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Thread: MotoGP: 2019 Round 06 - Gran Premio d'Italia Oakley (SPOILERS)

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by V4Victory View Post
    Could you see Marc being beaten by another Honda on Honda friendly track ? You could see he was absolutely delighted to get away with what he considers a bogie track with 20 points.
    If JLo ever figures out how to ride the Honda, yes I could see MM being beaten at a Honda track. MM hasn't had an equal team mate yet. I will be curious to see how he deals with one if he ever gets one. But also I am not sure Dovi and MM are the same type of rider. Dovi isn't quite as fast as MM but he is often smarter and typically makes fewer mistakes.

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuzziMoto View Post
    If JLo ever figures out how to ride the Honda, yes I could see MM being beaten at a Honda track. MM hasn't had an equal team mate yet. I will be curious to see how he deals with one if he ever gets one. But also I am not sure Dovi and MM are the same type of rider. Dovi isn't quite as fast as MM but he is often smarter and typically makes fewer mistakes.
    Dovi makes fewer mistakes than Marc because he doesn't push the limits like Marc does. As for being smarter, did you see qualifying at Mugello ?

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    The smartest guy wins 5 out of 6 championships in the premier class on the most difficult to ride(apparently) machine.
    I know what you mean but if Dovi is a smarter rider and doesn’t beat Marc then something doesn’t add up.

    Watching Dovizioso yesterday I felt he needed a little bit of extra aggression at times.
    To beat the man you gotta be the man if that makes any sense.

  4. #79
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    Make no mistake, I think Marc is faster than Dovi all else being equal. And clearly Marc has won more than Dovi. But Marc does tend to make mistakes more than Dovi does. It likely has something to do with Marc taking more chances than Dovi does. Sometimes taking chances is required, but sometimes Marc takes chances he never should have taken. See COTA from earlier this year.
    If Dovi does beat Marc to the title it will likely be because Dovi was smarter than Marc and not out and out faster than Marc. Often the fastest guy wins the title, but not always, Sometimes a smarter rider who is almost as fast can win the title.
    And as Cal seems able to do really well on the Honda it can't be that hard to ride. It is just hard to ride it like Marc does, getting that last little bit out of it. JLo struggling on it is no surprise, he struggles to learn how to ride new bikes, being slow to adapt. It was predicted when he went to Ducati, and it took him a year and a half to figure that one out. It will be interesting to see if he can figure out the Honda. By the way, when JLo jumped on the Yamaha it was already a winner (arguably it was worse when he left it). When he jumped on the Ducati it was already a winner (only he was better on it when he left). He likely did help make each bike a better bike for him to ride, but as to making the bike better over all that did not happen. And I am not sure it will happen with the Honda, although it could happen.

  5. #80
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    I cant remember Cal beating Marx in a straight up battle. Marc usually finishes on the podium even if the track doesn't suit the Honda. Dovi is now apparently critical of his Ducati mid corner and demanding that it's sorted. It is probably the best bike in motogp so he should be winning a lot more than he is

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    I’m not sure I 100% agree with certain tracks being suited to certain bikes more than the other as all bikes are changing year in year out.

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuzziMoto View Post
    As to Dovi being beaten by his team mate again at that track, that last lap was a crap shoot. Dovi could have won it just as easily as ended up third. In my opinion, Dovi would have been smarter to focus on keeping MM behind him rather than getting by DP. Had Dovi focused more on beating MM he may have ended up second rather than third. But he went for the whole thing and ended up the looser of the three. But if he had focused on beating MM and ended up second I am sure some would complain that he didn't try hard enough.
    this.

    and HRC can work with jl all they want, it does not need to translate to MM's bike......unless there is dramatic success of course. since jl is such a different rider, and since the honda seems to be FAR from his ideal setup, i hope they get something soon. honda will not wait forever.
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    I am gunna put it out there and say that mm will win two more titles with Honda to equal the hated ones record. Then jump ship to another bike. I’m gunna say Suzuki or Ducati. Yuall heard it here first.

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  8. #83
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    I'd have to disagree that Dovi is smarter than MM. MM crashes a lot in practice, but not that often in races. Since 2013 MM has 15 DNFs, and Dovi 16. Granted those numbers don't consider mechanicals or being taken out, but they're still useful. The bulk of those for MM were also in 2015, which is the only year he didn't win the championship and IMO the year in which he really matured as a racer. 4 of the years in that stretch MM only had 1 DNF, and he never had more than 3 except for 2015. That's impressive given his pace.

    MM is one of the smartest racers out there from a strategy and race craft perspective IMO. He's likely also the toughest mentally at the moment, as nothing seems to phase him. He's probably also the luckiest, as none of his crashes (mostly practice) have caught up with him yet.
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  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by CRMNL View Post
    this.

    and HRC can work with jl all they want, it does not need to translate to MM's bike......unless there is dramatic success of course. since jl is such a different rider, and since the honda seems to be FAR from his ideal setup, i hope they get something soon. honda will not wait forever.
    Honda wont care if MM is winning and I'm sure they will do all they can to keep him. Cant help but think that signing Jorge was a brilliant move , if only to keep from success on another bike.
    Honda make one chassis. They can tinker with seat position and the like all.they want but HRC never deviate from what they believe is right and they expect the riders to man up and get on with riding it. New parts are given to Bradl to test then given to the Repsol riders. Jorge is in for a torrid time.
    Honda have traditionally built bikes that understeer, even back to Foggy in the Rc45 days and Doohan on the NSR that's why Marc rides the front end how he does, bending the bike to his will and using a hard front tyre
    Last edited by V4Victory; 06-04-2019 at 01:01 PM.

  10. #85
    apriliaforum expert CRMNL's Avatar
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    good points all, but i will keep my mind open to outside the box considerations from honda. they may deviate from history IF something looks up. consider-IF jl were to find something race winning, but they needed to change something major on his bike, don't you think their emphasis would lean more towards having two world champions dominate on their bikes rather than any other considerations? i think that's what they want in jl. the keep him from others is plausible, but not as strong, i think. IF they can figure something out soon, i believe this is what we are looking at; if not.......bye bye whore ghey.
    "death from misadventure"

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    I am gunna put it out there and say that mm will win two more titles with Honda to equal the hated ones record. Then jump ship to another bike. I’m gunna say Suzuki or Ducati. Yuall heard it here first.

    ape66

  11. #86
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    I think we will see Jorge on a Yamaha again before he retires.

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by V4Victory View Post
    I think we will see Jorge on a Yamaha again before he retires.
    Why Yamaha? That bike is far from a winning form at the moment. It's going down.
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    With Vale not in the picture, I found myself wishing for only one thing; That somebody other than MM win! Couldn't have been happier. Actually, all 3 races were great. I am a big fan of Rossi, but I'm worried after such a poor showing. Maybe this is the inevitible "changing of the guard" that so many predict?

  14. #89
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    I don't know how flexible HRC is. I think they preferentially cater to whom they "think" gives them the best chance or whom they (Repsol) prefer. Remember after Nicky won the championship? You would think that they would cater to his needs for the next season, but instead they built the next bike around the midget, who had never won a championship. It severely hindered Nicky's chances. Me thinks the sponsors dictate where the effort goes.
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  15. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMH View Post
    Why Yamaha? That bike is far from a winning form at the moment. It's going down.
    I think he would be doing a lot better than Vinales or Rossi are currently managing. Zarco and Quaterwoshisname are the two most impressive Yamaha riders of the last 3 seasons and both have a smooth style like Lorenzo . Lorenzo I believe would be winning races on certain tracks.

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