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Thread: Too hot to start

  1. #1
    apriliaforum Member
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    Too hot to start

    What gets so hot after a ride that is stops the bike starting? Over a couple of rides recently - too few to tell whether this is starting to happen more frequently - I'll thumb the starter and nothing happens. The fuel pump primes, there's nothing untoward on the dash - but it's completely dead. The neutral light dims slightly when the starter's pressed which suggests the starter button itself is ok. Any ideas?

    The side-stand switch was new last year.

    I went to look at a Royal Enfield Hindustan in Salisbury this afternoon, funny old thing, quite liked it, but had to wait 40 mins while the bike cooled before the Capo would start. I could have taken the RE for a test ride!

    m
    Last edited by goldencapo; 06-15-2018 at 11:29 AM.

  2. #2
    apriliaforum expert haga lout's Avatar
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    Not the same thing but a few times over the years I've come to the capo and everything primes up as it shud then you press and it's like you have a flat battery clocks go off and everything I've found if you put it in second gear and rock it backwards it will then start as normal just think there's a spot just before tdc where it's not got inuff power to spin over the first time it did it was at a petrol station and I thought the battery was knackered got a jump start of a car and it was ok got a battery and had it in the top box for the rest of the week and it started every time didn't need the battary till the next Spring

  3. #3
    apriliaforum expert Nito's Avatar
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    Just food for thought but if you’re only noticing this when hot, as the wires get hot I imagine there would be more resistance, perhaps as a result there isn’t enough oomph to turn the starter motor over as the resistance is too high. Could be that one of those super duper earthing kits will help. Maybe the resistance is on the earth side and that cleaning up your earthing points may help. There’s a guy making earthing kits for Capo’s at the moment (I forget his name perhaps someone here can point you in right direction), I haven’t felt the need to go that route yet but maybe one day. I know many have fitted them and it has made a big difference to starting.

    cheers
    Nito
    2018 Ducati Diavel Diesel "Nel mezzo del cammin de nostra vita"
    2008 Caponord ETV 1000 ABS- "Il Capo"
    2002 Tuono 1000 RSV-R Limited Nr.035- "Hyperthrust Cleared and Counting..."
    1993 Ninja ZXR750R "NinjaR!!"
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  4. #4
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    Thanks both. I put it in gear at the time and rocked it, no joy.
    I know who you mean when you describe those kits Nito.
    i have a day free today and the weather's ok so I can fiddle about. Can you point me towards where the earthing points are - it's OK, found 'em?

    i forgot to add: it will restart if I've only just turned it off, it's when I leave it for 15-20 mins that it won't. It did restart after leaving it to cool for an hour.
    Last edited by goldencapo; 06-16-2018 at 08:45 AM.

  5. #5
    apriliaforum Junkie Diablo_UK's Avatar
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    I've had this a couple of times before, but always abroad, never UK temps. My TL-R would do on hot days and when sat in traffic, and I overrode that by adding a manual fans switch. (I think on the TL-R it was an engine management thing?)

    Not all who wander are lost......

  6. #6
    apriliaforum expert nerald's Avatar
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    I had this for years, let me down big style at a toll booth on a Greek motorway and involved sticking the bike in the back of a passing Brits artic truck. I eventually changed the starter motor - Sourced a new one for a Can Am spyder - It was the least expensive option. The difference in spin up speed was like night and day. Touch wood - I haven't had a problem with it since.
    08 ETV 1000 Caponord
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  7. #7
    apriliaforum expert calgaryjeff's Avatar
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    How old is your battery?
    2003 CapoNord
    1985 Honda VF1000R (gone to a new home)
    IBA #23204

  8. #8
    apriliaforum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by calgaryjeff View Post
    How old is your battery?
    Newish - 2 years? Occasionally on a trickle charger (bike's always outside).

  9. #9
    apriliaforum expert brmbrm's Avatar
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    Missed these posts because I've been away on hols.
    Long story short.
    Last 2 years very occasionaly my battery was too flat to turn the bike over. Even after charging the battery.
    Then OK.
    All voltages, charging and discharging always usually OK.
    Then cut out with low battery (coincidently in the heat in Spain)
    Then OK
    Then in UK after a long customs queue on very hot day.
    Then OK
    THen checked evry connector, all OK but slight corrosion here and there.
    Then earth kit, plus extra earth points.
    Then load test on battery, would only turn the bike over for 3 or 4 consecutive starts.
    So a new battery, now turns over MUCH faster.
    Conclusion - The old battery was not charging to the rated capacity even though all voltages were correct. Seems like once the battery has run flat it was actually nearly knackered.
    Using the charger regularley had masked the battery fault. Never thought it was the battery because usually it charged up and was OK. The proof for me was the load test of how long the battery lasted for consecutive starts, which was only 3 or 4 very short starts.
    So far it's OK
    My name is Dave,
    bike's name is Black Betty.

    When you're traveling, you are what you are right there and then.


    Caponord - Douglas Dragonfly - 1942 Harley back again
    Pegaso - Matchless G3LS - BSA A7SS - 1942 Harley - Matchless G80/600cc - Matchless G3LS - BSA C15 - Velocette

  10. #10
    apriliaforum expert Stu_O's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brmbrm View Post
    Missed these posts because I've been away on hols.

    Conclusion - The old battery was not charging to the rated capacity even though all voltages were correct. Seems like once the battery has run flat it was actually nearly knackered.
    Using the charger regularley had masked the battery fault. Never thought it was the battery because usually it charged up and was OK. The proof for me was the load test of how long the battery lasted for consecutive starts, which was only 3 or 4 very short starts.
    So far it's OK
    That's what happens to a starting battery (SLI type) when it's been run flat. A deep cycle battery is designed to be discharged to around 50% and still be capable of recharging to full capacity, but SLI batteries will be permanently damaged. Most folks don't realize this. I see a lot of folks claiming their battery is okay because it's only 6 months old, though that fact has little to do with the battery's condition or capacity. You're correct that constantly being attached to a maintainer can mask a worn out battery.

  11. #11
    apriliaforum Member
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    Hi Dave (and stu).
    And mine is only 18 months old - a Yuasa YTX14H-BS. I can't remember running it flat, maybe I did?

  12. #12
    apriliaforum expert Leanit's Avatar
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    Wires hate heat. Could be anything, either the battery doesn't have the power or the starter is demanding too much to deal with the restricted current when everything is hot. I know that answer isn't specific.

    I had a GTO that would slowly cook its starter about every other summer. When it would begin to happen, I'd have to park with the hood open. After a couple months that wouldn't even help, so I'd put in another starter ... for $19.

  13. #13
    apriliaforum expert brmbrm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goldencapo View Post
    Hi Dave (and stu).
    And mine is only 18 months old - a Yuasa YTX14H-BS. I can't remember running it flat, maybe I did?
    Hi GC
    Fully charge battery.
    Then how many consecutive starts, until low voltage condition?
    My name is Dave,
    bike's name is Black Betty.

    When you're traveling, you are what you are right there and then.


    Caponord - Douglas Dragonfly - 1942 Harley back again
    Pegaso - Matchless G3LS - BSA A7SS - 1942 Harley - Matchless G80/600cc - Matchless G3LS - BSA C15 - Velocette

  14. #14
    apriliaforum Member
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    Brm Brm: no starts at all is the answer, nada, not a click, whirr, whine or whistle. And no consistency to it either, was fine in Wales, always starts first go when cold. It behaved itself fine last ride

  15. #15
    apriliaforum expert brmbrm's Avatar
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    Hi GC,
    I'm sure you've already checked these?
    1. Battery voltage
    2. Dash ON ?
    3. Shut off button position?
    4. Pump prime noise?
    5. Fuses?
    6. STARTER SOLENOID/RELAY
    7. Ignition switch?
    8. Alarm immobiliser?
    9. The bike tipped over sensor?

    My occasional battery dead, occasional and intermittent fault probably was my battery - at least has not re-occurred since new battery fitted.
    Last edited by brmbrm; 06-29-2018 at 04:29 AM.
    My name is Dave,
    bike's name is Black Betty.

    When you're traveling, you are what you are right there and then.


    Caponord - Douglas Dragonfly - 1942 Harley back again
    Pegaso - Matchless G3LS - BSA A7SS - 1942 Harley - Matchless G80/600cc - Matchless G3LS - BSA C15 - Velocette

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