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Thread: POSTING: Starter Relay Mod: Futura w/ Ford Relay

  1. #151
    apriliaforum expert spesnaz's Avatar
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    Nice! Those teflon-tipped little solder poppers are quite handy. I just wrangled the original one apart, Deefred, and quickly realized I should have desoldered, as there was plenty of "meat" in those contacts left.

    Wonder why they are so "derated" to 50 Amperes, as that's a pretty ridiculous number, considering I have Bosch relays rated at 50A with no more than a 1mm contact circle.

    Bob

  2. #152
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    If you are going to put this much effort into the solenoid then also put effort into replacing the battery/starter cables by upgrading to 4 gauge cable.

    Here is link http://www.triumphrat.net/speed-trip...power-mod.html

    Yes its Triumph related but I have done this mod to Triumph, BMW, Ducati and April. To me well worth the $$ and time.

    No sense making the spigot bigger/better (solenoid) and not the hose (cable.)

    Cheers

    Philip

  3. #153
    apriliaforum expert Argh Oh's Avatar
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    A lazier, cheaper option (always appealing to me) is running an extra 10awg wire to everything starting from batt, including an extra ground. Works pretty well. I've also got the F150 solenoid. Make sure you clean all connections and grounds.
    01 Blue #84, 11/12 with: HeliBars, foam grips, 05 map, Borla cans (Replaced by 2" pipe)/stock silencer, derestricted, metal QD, dash socket, wiring mod. Me: Ford relay +10awg & grd, fuel pump rewire, FPR, vac hoses. Evap gone, CBR coils/harness+ Magnecor, clutch switch bypass. S.S. clutch & front line, RaceTech Gold fork, Cogent rebuilt Sachs, tapered head bearings. Added LED run lights/indicators/brake. All signals also run lights. All lights but Hi/park/brake on dash switch. Hi beam mod, vest plug, wiring block, blue dash SMD's/Red V meter, Tune IFT, PCIII gone. Stripped/polished rims, vented screen, rear petal disc. FH008 soldered DC plug/added grd/hard soldered AC. L/R dash indicator lights, RG frame/fork sliders, vented screen.

  4. #154
    apriliaforum Junkie Corsehf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Argh Oh View Post
    A lazier, cheaper option (always appealing to me) is running an extra 10awg wire to everything starting from batt, including an extra ground. Works pretty well. I've also got the F150 solenoid. Make sure you clean all connections and grounds.
    Done pretty much the same now with larger cables from the battery through to the starter. Also added larger earth to chassis & engine.

    I did notice that the throttle bodies are not earthed?? - any reason??

    I'm sure I remember being told or I read somewhere that adding a decent earth to somewhere near the injectors (this was on a car!) would give an improvement in running. Not sure if that was meant to be on economy or power?.

    Anything in this??
    Andy

    Current: 2002 Futura RST in Silver
    Datatagged, 05 Map, Metal QD, H Pipe, Bef Cans, RSV De-restrictive Snorkel, RSV Forks & Brakes upgrade, NGK DCPR8EIX Iridiums, Earthed Throttlebodies, FPR Mod, Vee Max Starter Solenoid with uprated cables, FH008EE RR & Wiring Mods, NWS Hugger, Oxford OF691 Touring Hotgrips, Accessory & USB Sockets, HID Headlight, Pirelli Angel GT's

    Up in Flames: 2001 Futura RST in Blue
    Datatagged, 05 Map, Skidmarx DB Screen & Hugger, K&N Filter, Brown Connectors soldered, R&G Hotgrips,
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  5. #155
    apriliaforum expert RAS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Corsehf View Post
    Done pretty much the same now with larger cables from the battery through to the starter. Also added larger earth to chassis & engine.

    I did notice that the throttle bodies are not earthed?? - any reason??

    I'm sure I remember being told or I read somewhere that adding a decent earth to somewhere near the injectors (this was on a car!) would give an improvement in running. Not sure if that was meant to be on economy or power?.

    Anything in this??
    Do the injectors just have 1 wire? Everything is controlled on the ground side of the ecu, so I'd guess there are 2 wires to each injector. If that's the case, then why both ground the TBs?

  6. #156
    apriliaforum expert deefred's Avatar
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    Correct, two wires to the injector.
    The injector is encapsulated in plastic, so grounding the TB does nothing.
    2001 RST Futura in stream Silver.
    Mods: Modified Öhlins fork from mille R, EBC 320mm brake discs, HEL front brakelines, Carbon RS 250 front fender, Wiring mod for charging. Engine related:05 map, Iridium plugs, tuneboy, derestriced intake, old mille airboot, staintunes exhaust. Lambda bung hardbrazed in the "breadbox". Öhlins mille R rear shock with 110N/mm spring and the integrated hydraulic preload adjuster. LED Voltmeter installed inside the dash for monitoring charging. Duc 999 radial m/c for brake and clutch.
    NWS hugger. Equipment: Famsa tankbag,
    CBR 600 -07 MOSFET R&R FH008EE providing stable 14.4 - 14.5 V (with my wiring mod). Daytona heated grips with mccoi pwm controller and automatic chain oiler

  7. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by Corsehf View Post
    Done pretty much the same now with larger cables from the battery through to the starter. Also added larger earth to chassis & engine.

    I did notice that the throttle bodies are not earthed?? - any reason??

    I'm sure I remember being told or I read somewhere that adding a decent earth to somewhere near the injectors (this was on a car!) would give an improvement in running. Not sure if that was meant to be on economy or power?.

    Anything in this??
    There might be something to it. I've done this on a Buell... the earth for the engine to the battery went through some painted subframe bolt points so it was always pretty poor. Ran a starter cable from the top engine mount right to the battery and got better starting, smoother running.

  8. #158
    apriliaforum Member Sid Viscous's Avatar
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    Here we go again

    This damned bike. So the tail end of last summer signed up for a 3,000 mile trip to Austria and back. First fuel stop 20 miles from home and it won't start. As we had non-refundable tickets for the channel train we decided to get to France first and work out what to do from there. The Honda shop in Calais confirmed the voltage at 12.6v @ 3,000rpm. Bugger. And I'd left a spare reg/rec at home. Double Bugger.

    So bought a new battery and charger with plan to ride on one battery while charging the other overnight at hotel. Amazingly, this worked ok but then it decided not to start on the button, even with the new battery. Shorting the solenoid terminals worked a treat, but was a bit impractical at every fuel / coffee / traffic light stall stop. So I jammed two wires into the solenoid feed connector block and connected them to an aux plug. Thus to start I just jammed that into the aux (cig lighter) socket and bingo off we went. This bodge allowed us to complete the trip without my long suffering mate keeling over trying to bump start 500lbs plus 1000cc high comp v-twin plus me sitting on top. When I got home I stuffed the bike to the back of the garage and bought something newer instead and tried to forget about it.

    But now I've got to fix the charging issue (again) and the starting issue. Have ordered a 150A solenoid from E-Bay, in case that's the problem (always start with the obvs), but not entirely sure it is, as my bodge would not have worked? I have good voltage from the switch, so will just earth out the blue wire and see if that works temporarily until the new solenoid arrives. From the schematic the blue wire heads off to the diode block and the disappears into the ECU, where I assume it must go to earth somewhere? By earthing it out I assume I am just avoiding safety features (neutral / side stand) and won't damage anything? The neutral light has only worked when it feels like it for years now but I assume this wouldn't interefere with starting (with the clutch in) as I haven't had any problems before.

    Any and all advice / abuse welcome!

  9. #159
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    Had this issue occur yesterday for my 20 mile commute home. I didn’t hear anything odd until i got home and turned off the bike and the starter kept going a few seconds until the battery died. Thanks to this awesome forum I ran and got a ford solenoid and got that swapped in easily. Charged the battery overnight and I was back on the road with basically no downtime. So glad this forum exists and the knowledge it contains.

  10. #160
    apriliaforum expert Motech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sid Viscous View Post
    ...the blue wire heads off to the diode block and the disappears into the ECU, where I assume it must go to earth somewhere?
    Yes. The ECU receives all starter enable/inhibit switch signals--sidestand, neutral, clutch, etc.--through that prickly diode pack, then provides ground to the starter relay through it's own ground circuits. This setup is the biggest weak electrical link in the chain of starter control circuits on all the V990 aprilia models, typically dropping 3 volts on that grounding circuit by the time it gets through all those barriers to the relay.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sid Viscous View Post
    By earthing it out I assume I am just avoiding safety features (neutral / side stand) and won't damage anything?
    Yes. On the one hand, it will provide impeccable ground integrity to the relay. On the other, with all the starter inhibit safety measures bypassed, the relearning curve could be exciting and potentially embarrassing.
    No Matter Where You Are, There You Go!

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