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View Full Version : New Aprilia i4 engine for WSB: Anyone heard anything?



RSV_Ecosse
07-19-2005, 11:37 AM
http://www.bikersoracle.com/rsv/forum/showthread.php?t=2908


Dunno if its all "hearsay" or not, maybe I've missed a thread here containing the info.

RFM
07-19-2005, 11:52 AM
Fingers crossed! I want a Superbike dominating the tracks again!!!!

Ricky J
07-19-2005, 12:44 PM
If the rumor is true, then it would be great to see Aprilia playing again.

On the other hand, it is unfortunate that superbike rules almost force them to build a motor so similar to what corporate beancounters at the Big Four prefer, and not something a little more "passionate" and Italian.

Maybe these happy years of Aprilia twin ownership have ruined me to I-4s...my heart really is dead to them! :(

Jet City Racer
07-19-2005, 12:49 PM
Maybe riding an F4 would stir your heart. :lover:

http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/3448/mv356gd.jpg

RSV_Ecosse
07-19-2005, 12:56 PM
Maybe these happy years of Aprilia twin ownership have ruined me to I-4s...my heart really is dead to them! :(


I know exactly where you are coming from there, Ricky. I feel the same way.

Cant see me going back to an I-4 for some considerable time tbh.

As far as Aprilia "giving in" and building an I-4 goes, again, I know what you are talking about, but to be quite honest, I would love to see a new Aprilia team make a serious challenge in WSB in the future. They managed it well when they first unveiled the Mille a few years ago, but then again, a powerful motor doesn't strictly mean a race winning design.

Look at the RS3 Cube for an example of that. :cool:

Ricky J
07-19-2005, 01:03 PM
[QUOTE=Jet City Racer]Maybe riding an F4 would stir your heart.QUOTE]

Said it before and here again: I would NOT trade the fantastic 2000.5 RSV in my garage for anything on a showroom today, including that thing!

Either I'm nuts, or the most devoted Aprilia owner here.

Could be both. :D

JJ_008
07-19-2005, 01:30 PM
[QUOTE=Jet City Racer]Maybe riding an F4 would stir your heart.QUOTE]

Said it before and here again: I would NOT trade the fantastic 2000.5 RSV in my garage for anything on a showroom today, including that thing!

Either I'm nuts, or the most devoted Aprilia owner here.

Could be both. :D

I totally agree w/ you. I have yet to find a bike that I would trade my 2000.5 Mille for. When I was at Laguna, the only bike that made me really interested in a new bike was the BMW K1200R. If they make a Power Cup replica, it will be mine.

On topic, I think its a bummer that Aprilia is going to go w/ a I4 configuration. I think a V4 would be the most natural progression. But hey, if Aprilia's racing then I am happy.

TheWheel
07-19-2005, 02:28 PM
I don't see why Aprilia has to be web to the v-twin engine. They're not Ducati. It's obvious a 4 has more potential under the current rules in AMA, BSB, and WSBK. The MV is plenty Italian...and an inline 4. Like JJ_008, I'd prefer a v4.

PAID BY FORD
07-19-2005, 06:10 PM
I agree with ricky j, in fact i sold my 05 mv agostini, i could have parted with any of the bikes in my garage but i still have my factory, and my ducatis and my guzzis. Wow let me think for a minute, those are all my V twins. Dont get me wrong, I dont have a bad thing to say about my MV but I just didnt have the same feelings for it like my other bikes. Especially my factory.

Jet City Racer
07-19-2005, 06:32 PM
My 2000.5 was the coolest bike I've ever owned, PERIOD.

When I first got it, I would park on Santa cruz Ave in Los Gatos and people who didn't even ride would just stop and stare. There were a few "special nights" when I was glad I chose to buy the 2 seater too. :lover:

go_modem_go
07-19-2005, 07:53 PM
I agree with ricky j, in fact i sold my 05 mv agostini, i could have parted with any of the bikes in my garage but i still have my factory, and my ducatis and my guzzis. Wow let me think for a minute, those are all my V twins. Dont get me wrong, I dont have a bad thing to say about my MV but I just didnt have the same feelings for it like my other bikes. Especially my factory.See. The guy who has it all sells the MV and keeps the old derilict 2 pots.

Now, the parted MV is a four-pot, although a beautiful one.

Tin Lizzy's and Ford Pinto's had inline-4's, my current Citroen Hdi has one, every Japanese ss bike is blessed with it, and now a new '07 RS1000 Prilla? :rolleyes:

Aprilia should have just installed a twin-Turbo on the Rotax, to cater for the hp-mad R1 crowd which has to buy a new inline-4 appliance every 2nd year because they have gained another 5hp@16500rpm at top speed via air ram...

I will stay with thumpers and V2's. At least they still feel alive and mechanical, compared to the smooth electric fourpots.

TheDuke
07-19-2005, 08:52 PM
If Aprilia were to do an I-4 but did a big bang config, or some other kind of alternate firing order, would that change peoples thinking?

Red
07-19-2005, 09:47 PM
I would like to see how competive they are with a triple or inline four.Let use see what they can muster with new backing/money.OZ rims being spun up on a inline......................who would be a good development rider?

TheDuke
07-19-2005, 09:54 PM
who would be a good development rider?
Peter Goddard

Jet City Racer
07-19-2005, 10:29 PM
who would be a good development rider?That's easy, me and Clarkie.

He can see how fast it goes and I can crash test and over rev it to see how much abuse it can take. :D

BIG DAVE
07-19-2005, 11:23 PM
I heard several conversations around the Aprilia camp about a possible V-4. Also heard that they have secured oodles of Euros to bring the brand back to flagship status. I really hope the first is true, and it seems the second is for sure. Aprilia seems to have the desire to be unique, yet they intend to race SBK again as well. With all of their financial issues of the past maybe the I-4 is the best way to re-surface. All I know is that I love this company and their product. GO APRILIA!!!!! I don't care what they make, it'll more than likely have a few more cool points than the next guy.

Turpentine
07-20-2005, 01:40 AM
Banger I-4 was the first thing I thought too.
Anyone heard why the Cube wouldn't be continued? Any possibility of it being homologated anyway? Strange for it to be mentionned this late after the takeover, even in rumors, only to be dropped once more.

kiwifalco
07-20-2005, 02:13 AM
That's easy, me and Clarkie.

He can see how fast it goes and I can crash test and over rev it to see how much abuse it can take. :D
:funnypost :funnypost :funnypost .
I would love to see them go for the V4.Couple of big bore 450s' slapped together would be extra curly. :cheers:

Ricky J
07-20-2005, 09:12 AM
Historically, European manufacturers have not been able to price match the Japanese brands so they've employed a strategy of product differentiation to help sell product. While not the way to top sales charts it IS an effective way to justify your "premium" prices: for a few dollars more, you get something different than what others have...

If Aprilia go to an inline four at least some of that uniqueness disappears and you're left fighting against comparable products that cost less, and if those less expensive machines perform better you are really up against it. The Japanese are on two-year product update schedules now and even with Piaggio's backing that will be extraordinarily difficult and costly to match.

onefastworm
07-20-2005, 11:59 AM
Historically, European manufacturers have not been able to price match the Japanese brands so they've employed a strategy of product differentiation to help sell product. While not the way to top sales charts it IS an effective way to justify your "premium" prices: for a few dollars more, you get something different than what others have...

If Aprilia go to an inline four at least some of that uniqueness disappears and you're left fighting against comparable products that cost less, and if those less expensive machines perform better you are really up against it. The Japanese are on two-year product update schedules now and even with Piaggio's backing that will be extraordinarily difficult and costly to match.

That's true, but look at the MV Agusta and how much they get for those things. And anytime someone tells me the prices are high for the Aprilia I tell them, look at what you get, Brembo, Ohlins, Sachs. And the design engineering and engineering that goes into these bikes is amazing. I couldn't even imagine going back to a Japanese bike for anything except a beater, so I don't have to put wear on my beautiful RSV. And if Aprilia make a dirtbike or supermoto type bike, I'll be first in line to get one of those too.

ZeroTwoRSV
07-20-2005, 05:30 PM
I would like to see them race again, and keep the VTwins for the patrons. Ducati does a nice job of selling bikes that are not race replicas, why Aprilia do the same? Make your race rep and keep your VTwin models too :cigar:

So long as they can make the bike close to the front, and get a good rider, it should be positive publicity. Oh, and I'd like a two rider team please :cathat:

GeoR
07-20-2005, 07:24 PM
I'm not fond of inline 4s or of parallel twins either but a V4 sure it's got "character", I'd like that. I was hopping Suzuki did well on the first year of the motogp so they would market a ligher and affordable V4...then I got real excited about the Ducati "siamese" V4 (firing in pairs) that to me sounds like the perfect engine.

I guess I'm a V type of guy?

About twins, the reason that Ducati didn't just fade away from the market is that they won a lot of wsb races and they got their fame from that. Believe you me I remember the years when I got the same reaction at my Ducs as most here have experienced with their prilias "who makes that?"

IMO not everyone wants to be a racer and these days there's plenty of "real" (life long) riders that have experienced twins and would rather ride those over most everything else for it to be a solid market.

We may stray for the latest go-fastest toy here and there but mostly we all come back to twins.
For most of my riding buddies they got hooked with the Honda Superhawk and now pretty much the only thing they would consider is another Vtwin.

Sal Khan
07-20-2005, 11:16 PM
Banger I-4 was the first thing I thought too.
Anyone heard why the Cube wouldn't be continued? Any possibility of it being homologated anyway? Strange for it to be mentionned this late after the takeover, even in rumors, only to be dropped once more.

Because Triples Suck for competitive road racing.

bull*ramus
08-07-2005, 07:27 AM
a v-4 would be ideal, i'd trade for one of those, or how about a compromise, the world's first production big bang inline 4?, it would be easier for them to squeeze power out of one of those as opposed to a twin and it would keep (most) of us twin fans happy.

Smoke Eater
08-07-2005, 09:52 AM
When I was at the USGP I had a long conversation with some of the highups from Aprilia. They told me that Aprilia IS getting back into Superbike and the motor is DONE. They said its already making 190+ horsepower.

Ricky J
08-07-2005, 09:56 AM
:D

Is that for the street or racing version? If it's the latter, they only need about another twenty or thirty.

Hopefully they will not have forgotten the lessons taught so dearly by the Cube. Peak power was not really the problem, usable delivery and building an effective chassis around it were. No matter what they put together they cannot afford- literally- to screw that up again...

RSheale
08-07-2005, 02:39 PM
YES YES! YES!!

i'm liking the sound of this new model

sounds like a its gonna be a groin grabbingly good bike!

Turpentine
08-08-2005, 04:33 AM
Anyone heard if it's a banger?

Ricky J
08-08-2005, 06:29 AM
We haven't heard such a thing but I would consider that the least likely of all scenarios because they have no previous experience with that technology, even the people who do have not mass produced one yet.

Crono
08-12-2005, 02:31 AM
I wouldn't fancy an Aprilia 4-L for the same reason I wouldn't buy any 4-L. I simply don't like the concept.
There is a BMW K1200 R Cup already at least here in Europe. That bike sounds great. I have seen it lately in a 24h. endurance race and was in the top 10. Not bad but not as fast as the R-1 and GSX-R's.
The Aprilia Supermoto is almost ready for the market and will come in 2006.
There will also be an Enduro and MX version (450), maybe I will then trade in my VOR 503, which on the other hand is an awfully fast and nice handling bike.
The only thing I would trade my 2000.5 "red hot" Mille for would be a 900 cc (or around) Aprilia RS triple. Only the sound of a triple is enough to get me excited.
Funny also to see that the 2000.5 seems to be the most beloved model range of the RSV's. Personally I like it most and wouldn't trade it for any newer model.

hass
08-12-2005, 02:45 AM
Because Triples Suck for competitive road racing.Tell that to Honda - they are testing a Motogp triple... :rolleyes:

Sal Khan
08-12-2005, 10:07 AM
Tell that to Honda - they are testing a Motogp triple... :rolleyes:

V3, Not I3. BIG difference.

Ricky J
08-12-2005, 10:20 AM
Sal, when are you going to post pictures from your visit to the HRC skunk works?

Sal Khan
08-12-2005, 10:23 AM
Sal, when are you going to post pictures from your visit to the HRC skunk works?

Had to use a disposable Google rumor camera. It's being developed at CVS right now.

Ricky J
08-12-2005, 10:42 AM
And good work with that Romulan cloaking device! HRC's a much more dangerous location after they hired Oddjob for security. :D

Sal Khan
08-12-2005, 10:48 AM
Damn those Romulans...

My disapprovals for I3 engines for racing isn't unfounded.

http://www.motorcycledaily.com/21february05_motogpengines.htm - Some reasons why on top of the same problems you'd have in a street bike.

hank
08-12-2005, 11:11 AM
Silly humans... everyone knows that Dilithium Crystals work best in a hyperdrive engine configuration - just make sure the flux capacitor is properly set up.

Sal Khan
08-12-2005, 11:16 AM
Damnit Hank! You don't know what you're talking about again! Dilithium Crystals work with WARP drives and matter/antimatter combustion.

And hyperdrive is just make believe... Damn Star Wars. :D :)

Ricky J
08-12-2005, 11:31 AM
Inline triples have been successful in the distant past, perhaps due more to major weaknesses in the competition's designs than anything inherently virtuous about an I-3. Modern four cylinder machines on the other hand are extremely well developed and increasingly follow proven paths of success. Do they have any large flaws that a well designed I-3 could exploit? That I think is doubtful, though there are times where Foggy Petronas' triples look very respectable given their 100cc deficit. If Aprilia is building a three more out of the desire to be "different" than to be successful that is somewhat understandable but racing is already expensive and difficult enough when you have the best machine possible, much less something compromised by a need to go your own way. If the latter is the case why not just stay home, save your money, and perfect a line of supersport 1100cc or 1200cc twins?

Which would sell more, a mid-pack running production RS3 that's "amost a four" or some very refined bigger twins that are not raced in SBK but could top the Master Bike annual shootouts?

All of us here would be happy to be proven wrong if Aprilia fielded a triple that went on to SBK glories, but that won't be how I wager my hard earned.

Beyote
08-12-2005, 01:33 PM
Man, if Aprilia makes it a production bike and not just a homolagation special, I will buy it for sure. I love I4s ,but the passion lies with the Twin. If it has the big bang config, I am sure soul will ooze from it's engine bay.

And by the way, as long as the warp core containment field is properly aligned, 190+ bee aitch pees should be managable with the correct cells.

(my roomate had to help me on that last part)

clarkie49
08-12-2005, 02:06 PM
I have built a couple of 'big bang' Aprilia engines, they fired 60' apart, only problem was they werent supposed to :D

2am in the morning before heading off to a race in 2001 and i couldnt for the life of me understand why i could see the plugs fire when the intake valves were open :D

fnfalman
08-12-2005, 02:12 PM
I wouldn't fancy an Aprilia 4-L for the same reason I wouldn't buy any 4-L. I simply don't like the concept.
There is a BMW K1200 R Cup already at least here in Europe. That bike sounds great. I have seen it lately in a 24h. endurance race and was in the top 10. Not bad but not as fast as the R-1 and GSX-R's.
The Aprilia Supermoto is almost ready for the market and will come in 2006.
There will also be an Enduro and MX version (450), maybe I will then trade in my VOR 503, which on the other hand is an awfully fast and nice handling bike.
The only thing I would trade my 2000.5 "red hot" Mille for would be a 900 cc (or around) Aprilia RS triple. Only the sound of a triple is enough to get me excited.
Funny also to see that the 2000.5 seems to be the most beloved model range of the RSV's. Personally I like it most and wouldn't trade it for any newer model.

While I understand the need to develope a winning chassis and egine, there still a need for a potent V-twin. I don't care if Aprilia were to win MotoGP, WSB, or whatever with its I4 engine, I still wouldn't buy it. I'm not a racer and when I get to the track, the V-twin will serve just fine. I'm sure that I'll be faster than some and slower than others. An I4 isn't going to change that.

I am a hard core BMW guy and I was all excited about the K1200S and K1200R until I rode them and decided to buy a Tuono instead.