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rx80
05-03-2014, 07:45 AM
alright, im starting a race build on my 2010 aprilia rx 50. ive ordered alot of parts, including a keihin pwk flatside carb. which of course doesnt support the autolube system as it doesnt have the oil inlet on the carb. would i be alright to do away with the complete auto lube pump & tank and just run premixed fuel? anyone had any experience with this? any answers appreciated



250683
:burnout:

Spudgun60
05-03-2014, 08:02 AM
Have you thought about getting a manifold that has the oil inlet?

RS_Patrick
05-03-2014, 08:09 AM
You can fit a nipple to the manifold your self, ive done that many times my self.

Doesnt matter if its an aluminium Aluminium or Rubber manifold.

On aluminium manifolds you just drill a hole slightly smaller than the threaded end of the nipple and cut the correct thread it.
Than put some loctite or setting sealer on the threaded part of the nipple and screw it in, not to tight or you ruin the thread, there wopnt be much load on it anyway.

On a Rubber manifold you basicly do the same thing, (dont make it more roomy, the niple should fit really tight.
On the threaded part of the nipple you than put some sealer or non hardening 2 component glue and turn it in carefully.

You need a nipple like this:
http://alshobbies.com/shop/ThumbImages/3mm-Nipple-150.jpg

Depending on the parts you use you need to mix some extra oil trough the fuel like 1:100.

Adavantage: your bike gets the right amount of feul depending on throttle position and rpm, and if you cant get premix oil because you had to stop at an unmanned petrol station, its not a disater, you can just drive on carefully to your home etc.




If you want to remove the oiltank and oilpump put it away safe and put a metal/aluminium plate with a gasket over the hole of the oilpump drive.

Premix 1:35.

Disadvantage: if your driving calmy the bike gets to much oil and you get carbon/gunk buildup on the plug and in the exhaust and you Always need oil with you to premix if you need to fill up or buy it on site, wich means you can not refeul at an unmaned petrol station unless you have oil with you.

rx80
05-03-2014, 08:31 AM
cheers for the reply spud, i didnt know those existed. thanks patrick! better reply than i could of hoped for. and i think ill go for the removal option to save on what little weight it adds and save a couple of quid, as i dont mind premixing and i wont be riding it calmly. the smell too!

RS_Patrick
05-03-2014, 09:09 AM
You need to premix your self @ 1:35, use Fully Syntetic 2 Stroke Oil, preferably Premix only oils.

In the long term Preimxing your self will cost you a whole lot more as you use more oil, so instead of saving a couple of quid its gonna cost you already by the time you buy the 3rd bottle of oil compaired to what the nipple etc. would have cost.

Zav
05-03-2014, 09:23 AM
[QUOTE=rx80;3625510]alright, im starting a race build on my 2010 aprilia rx 50. ive ordered alot of parts, including a keihin pwk flatside carb. which of course doesnt support the autolube system as it doesnt have the oil inlet on the carb. would i be alright to do away with the complete auto lube pump & tank and just run premixed fuel? anyone had any experience with this? any answers appreciated



250683
:burnout:[/QUOTE
some quick questions

what's rest of your setup?
what track and series you planning on going in?( as some series only let 50cc and 16mm carb and if find out your cheating you will be banned and if go in a 80cc or 125 you will get smoked)
are you planning on using on road at all?
are you changing the forks and rear shock?(you will need to if you haven't already as new shape forks and shock are crap the older ones a hell of a lot better)

if planning on using on road I wouldn't go premix simply because a tuned d50b0 drinks fuel I got 30mpg with a airsal 70 and 24mm and if usin on road premix tends to kill bearings and cranks as doesn't get enough oil on tick over

RS_Patrick
05-03-2014, 09:35 AM
[and if usin on road premix tends to kill bearings and cranks as doesn't get enough oil on tick over

Thats not true at all mate, as 1:35 premix will Always be 1:35 premix, the exact oposite will happen as it doesnt need that much oil while idle or at low rpm, carbon/gunk will build up on the sparkplug, piston, head and inside the exhaust, and the oil can gather in a little pool at the bottom of the crankcase, and wen you than try to rev the engine it might blow the crankseals.

Zav
05-03-2014, 09:41 AM
Alright then jut somet all the rs250 and egg guys say as they have cranks what have blown though premix when using on road as you also require a bigger main jet when premixing as it make the bike lean

but if you say it doesn't happen it doesn't I guess on small cc bikes just thought was same for all

RS_Patrick
05-03-2014, 10:07 AM
Thats B.S. dude, use your head, 1:25 premix feul, is Always 1:35 premix fuel, doesnt matter what setup or engine you got, or if your at full throttle or idle, it will Always be 1:35 premix feul.

Worked on plenty of 2 stroke race engines mate from 25cc to 3000cc and they all behave the same with premix oil.

Zav
05-03-2014, 10:20 AM
Okay Patrick be nice now I am so you should be too :)



but yeah premixing is just too much hassle but yes you may get a tad more hp by removing it due to less friction but not worth it you will get more gains removing counter balance and rubber mounting the engine

RS_Patrick
05-03-2014, 11:10 AM
Im not trying to be rude at all or anthing, just trying to explain why it isnt so, so people dont get the wrong idea of what you said as its completly the other way round.
All you needed to do it think logicaly to figure it out, instead you come up with more B.S. again...

Spudgun60
05-03-2014, 01:41 PM
In the days before autolube, premix was all you had. As Patrick says: It doesn't matter what the throttle opening is, it's still getting the correct oil/petrol ratio. Considering the number of manufacturers and the number of 2-strokes made without autolube over the decades.... Well, go figure.

If anything, autolube mimics the premix system. The volumetric pump merely injects oil into the engine at a given ratio (let's say 24:1). It doesn't matter if the engine is at idle or at full throttle. The volumetric pump still injects oil at the same ratio (24:1 at idle. 24:1 at full throttle). Now for a laugh.

There are differences in the oil-petrol ratios. I ruined 2 cranks in my old Bantam through my own stupidity. The Owners Manual gave 2 ratios. 32:1 and 24:1. The 32:1 ratio was for using engine oil in the petrol (EG: Castrol GTX). The 24:1 ratio was for proper 2-stroke oil. Guess what I did?

mattology
05-03-2014, 04:12 PM
Autolube can actually be better under high rpm low throttle situations ...

RS_Patrick
05-03-2014, 05:03 PM
Keep in mind that the oilpump only gives the specified ratio for a fully stock bike (stock mpg) and if you increase the feul consumption by making modifications to the bike, than the oilpump will not give the same ratio, but it becomes less.

I think the oilpump gives something like 1 liter of oil per 1200 kilometers (83.3cc per 100 kilometers) at full capacity, so from there you can do the math how much you would need to mix extra to keep the 1:35 ratio if you know how much your bike consumes.
You guys can sort it out your self what it is in gallons per mile, as a US-Gallon and a UK-Gallon are difrent (US-Gallon = 3.785 liters while the UK-Gallon = 4,546 liters)

rx80
05-04-2014, 08:23 AM
im not entering any proper races zav, just using it at a local mx track with no restrictions. the rest of the mods include airsal 80 kit, doppler race crank, doppler wr7 exhaust, and a doppler clutch. ill also get the mvt ignition when i can afford to. does anyone know what forks and shock will fit my rx? some good solid ones preferably off a pure bred crosser. and thanks for all your input patrick you are fountain of information