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magzx12r
11-26-2003, 10:58 AM
What hp/torque (at the back wheel) can I expect from the '04 RSVR/Factory with the following mods:

1) Full exhaust such as Akrapovic
2) High flow air filter such as BMC Race Filter
3) Remap at dealer or custom map with Power Commander

I know hp isn't everything, but I am trying to get a feel for what I will be working with if I get the RSVR.

Also, on the street/backroads, will an average rider be able to tell the difference in handling between the RSVR and the Factory?

confucius
11-26-2003, 12:43 PM
i'm not sure about hp #'s including mods. the stock motor is putting out around 120. with an air box kit + full exhaust + map... maybe 5-8 more. that's probably a conservative estimate. anybody that has the full akra have thoughts on this?

as far as the difference between the r and the factory.... if you're not going to do any track days or you are new to the track day scene, the r should be sufficient. i know what you're thinking: that $18k price tag for the factory + mods is pretty scary. give the standard model a try and once you get up to speed with that bike and you want to start doing some track days, upgrade. :D

andy

ChicagoFactory
11-26-2003, 01:37 PM
I'm still a novice rider, but I went for the Factory even though the standard R would be way more than I need. This purchase was more want, than need. I just wanted all the high end components now, so I don't have to add anything later other than the obvious, exhaust, airbox/filter, and maybe a custom map. I would have to do that to the standard model anyway.

I bought the standard back in 01, and even though I was completely happy with handling of it, I wish I would have bought the R. This time around, I didn't make that mistake of wondering how the Top of the Line would feel.

Just my .02.

Mike

PS. I have the GREATEST WIFE IN THE WORLD, for allowing me to get this bike. I owe her BIG TIME!!!!!!!!!!!

powermaster
11-26-2003, 03:26 PM
http://www.renegade-products.com/renegade/messages/276/2741.jpg

ChicagoFactory
11-26-2003, 06:40 PM
Jorge,

With your exhaust & airkit, did you use the "other" race map in the stock chip, or did you make a custom one with a PC?

Thanks,

Mike

powermaster
11-27-2003, 07:03 AM
I have not, I am yet to see a graph with the "tuned" codes as I am getting desperate taking that we wish to race them, but with at present 140 rw this is going to be a job and a half. I wonder if Ed has had the chance to test one, according to a British Mag, the HP recoeded was the same on a DJ dyno.

ChicagoFactory
11-27-2003, 10:59 AM
Jorge,

I'm a little confused on your answer.:confused:

Are you saying that you haven't figured out how to activate the race map? So are you using the standard, stock map, or a custom one to get your claimed #'s?

Please explain as I really like the Red line on the graph. Nice and linear.

Thanks,

Mike

powermaster
11-27-2003, 05:37 PM
I will try to explain.
The tests you see are with the STD maps. I have to date not seen any graphs with the so called "tuned" maps.
To date we have achieved 140rw with my 98 engine and although we are intending to race the 04 I am a bit worried of it's claimed power, or what we got so far.
We may end up just going with the older version. I know that Clarkie wants to have a go at one, but 116rw to 138(crank, claimed or =127 wheel) is a long way just from repmapps.

ChicagoFactory
11-27-2003, 10:02 PM
Jorge,

I'm no mechanic by any stretch, but I thought that HP at the wheel is about 15% less of crank HP. By my math, that would be about 117 RWHP stock , real close to your claimed 116. So Aprilia was right on with their claims of 138 at the crank. I don't know what you mean by "claimed or =127 wheel" I think you could squeeze out about 2-5 more HP with a good map.

I'm curious, what HP did your 98 engine put out stock? I don't think it was anywhere near 117 was it?

I may be way of base here, but I would think if you could get 140 HP out of an older engine, it should be more easily obtained with a newer, improved motor.

Just a thought

Mike

powermaster
11-28-2003, 10:33 AM
Does the 15% equation works, on the Aprilia's case I note that the loss tend to be 9 to 11bhp, here is an example.



http://www.renegade-products.com/renegade/messages/276/2706.jpg

ChicagoFactory
11-28-2003, 12:57 PM
The link doesn't work for me.

9-11 HP is less than 15% of the claimed 138. That would put it at about 127 RWHP. I'd love to have that stock. Sport Rider dynoed the 04 at 122 RWHP stock. I'd be happy with that also.

Check this link out.
http://www.sportbikes.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=137682

Mike

clarkie49
11-28-2003, 02:31 PM
i agree,

if even if you use the Factory Pro conversion from crankshaft down to 'true hp' it works out around 103-105hp which i believe is what mich/ed got on their stoick dyno

milleman
12-01-2003, 12:21 PM
what mods have done to that bike? is that at the tire or the crank?

ChicagoFactory
12-01-2003, 01:42 PM
Jorge,

Is this dyno graph with your 98 "built" motor? Pretty impressive!
You are correct then, that in this case, the 15% rule doesn't apply.
Does that mean Aprilia's claim of 138 HP at the crank is wrong?

From your experience then, the new 04's are really only putting out about 128 HP at the crank. Is that what you got with your 04? I see you got 116 RWHP form your stock 04. I just read Cycle World magazine, and they got 117 RWHP out of their 04 test bike, so you may be on to something. Either way, it's still putting out more HP than the previous bikes, just not as much as they claim.

Very interesting! I really don't care what the numbers say, I still love my new Factory no matter how much HP it puts out. But I am curious as to Jorges findings, and what Aprilia USA would say about this.

Mike

Manu
12-01-2003, 03:33 PM
Moto journal did a RSV Factory /1K Gixer comparo and dynoed both bikes on a dynojet.
Factory got 125 RWHP for 139 claimed at the crank.
1K Gix got 149 RWHP for 164 claimed at the crank.
Both loses look pretty similar around 10%.
The RSV didn' t seem weak at all. Top speed was 281 km/h.

powermaster
12-01-2003, 05:21 PM
Is this dyno graph with your 98 "built" motor? Pretty impressive!You are correct then, that in this case, the 15% rule doesn't apply.Does that mean Aprilia's claim of 138 HP at the crank is wrong?

Yes that is one of the race bikes from 2003, as for aprilia, I really don't know what is going on? All I can say is that the bikes I have dynoed have shown identical power take or leave a couple of ponies, what surprises me is the 04 owners not commenting on it instead they seem to have alienated themselves from the rest of the Aprilia board?


and they got 117 RWHP out of their 04 test bike It looks like my dyno is not so optimistic after all :)




I still love my new Factory no matter how much HP it puts out. This is basically what I have been saying, noone doubts this but the fact is that we have been told one thing and noone is asking the questions. very odd?

Manu, the results from MJ seem to be figures with race cans on as they are around what I am getting from both machines in race set up.
:confused:

Read Bike mag latest. the tester is one that tested the RSV in it's launch.

I don't want to sound negative as we intend to race the 04 and believe it possible to get 150 at the wheel ,but the work is not going to be easy.
Today we finished the headwork on Mille from a member of this board, let's hope he can tell us how he feels.

stinky
12-01-2003, 05:47 PM
Originally posted by powermaster
...All I can say is that the bikes I have dynoed have shown identical power take or leave a couple of ponies, what surprises me is the 04 owners not commenting on it instead they seem to have alienated themselves from the rest of the Aprilia board?


What do you mean by this, Jorge? I'm confused.

powermaster
12-01-2003, 06:17 PM
what part of it, that the 04s only seem to have around 118 rw or that 04 owners are not commenting much about it?

:rolleyes:

stinky
12-01-2003, 06:50 PM
I was confused as to how you thought we were alienating ourselves from the rest of the board. I personally am not a big peak hp numbers guy - maybe it's from having bikes with more peak hp in the past. At any rate, I didn't think failing to comment would alienate me, although at one point a while back I did mention that my first RSV (a 2000.5 Mille) made 108 rwhp with a slip-on and chip. That's the only time I've had any of my 9 bikes so far on a dyno.

Frankly, I'm pretty happy with where I am with a full system and the race map activated.

Manu
12-02-2003, 03:04 PM
Originally posted by powermaster
Manu, the results from MJ seem to be figures with race cans on as they are around what I am getting from both machines in race set up.
:confused:
Jorge
From the text and pics both bikes were 100% stock. The only thing special about the RSV Factory is that it was registred in Italia. Actually foreign registration is the only way to ride a non-106 HP restricted bike on the street of France. So it could have been a "good one" selected at the factory and sent to France for the comparo.
A 999S was also involved in the test, but not dynoed. The RSV kicked its ass out.... 20 more kmph top speed, 0.3 sec better under 400 m acceleration and 0.5 under 1000 m.