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Thread: Rapid Bike EVO Exclusive (KRBEVO-032A-EX)

  1. #46
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    I think I missed details of how the fuel adaptation works: is it a wide-band O2 sensor? If so, how will that affect the ECU's closed loop operation and own "self-learning" routine?

    I love how smooth my bike is with the O2 sensor disconnected, but the service warning is annoying...
    2009 Shiver (White) | UK

  2. #47
    apriliaforum expert rule62's Avatar
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    It still uses the stock narrow-band sensor to sense lean/stoich/rich and then adjusts the fueling to a theoretical 13.2 AFR. Not sure what the sample rate is, but I remember reading it somewhere. Hundred times a second or so.

    After a few hundred miles (when the adaptive feature builds a decent map all the way for each cell) I plan to take it to a dyno shop to analyze the actual exhaust/AFR. The RB EVO has fine tuning options to dial in actual target AFR. So if the base theoretical 13.2 actually turns out to be 14.1, or 12.8, or whatever... the fine tuning can be adjusted (using an actual analyzer) to an exact target.

    RB also sells a wide band O2 module that runs through a CAN-BUS connection. It doesn't eliminate the stock sensor (so no error codes result). It runs parallel. The ECU sees the stock sensor, but the wide band overrides to the adaptive feature and, obviously, provides a much faster and finer rate of tune. You can run multiple wide band sensors too. Getting a pair of 900 headers, with separate O2 bungs, and running 2 wide bands will allow the EVO to build individual maps for each cylinder. Definitely cool! But expensive.

    I'm not planning any race competition with this lump, so the single map, narrow-band tuning is more than adequate for my purposes.
    2014 DD 750 ABS - Spark exhaust, Arrow decat, headers (all ceramic coated), BMC filter, BikeMaster DLFP16-BS LiFePO battery, NGK iridium plugs, GPR steering damper, DD 1200 fully adjustable rear shock w/spring swap, 2016 Tuono Factory wheels, 15/44 520 conversion (PBR/Superlite/DID), Strada-7 fork preload adjusters, Samco 2-piece hose kit w/clamps, Engine Ice, Renazco Racing seat, EvoTech tidy tail, Aprilia grab handles, shorty levers, crank-case breather mod, evap-can delete... and a Rapid Bike EVO.

  3. #48
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    At least the dyno test will show if it is hitting the target, but what's to say your subsequent adjustment in the RB EVO unit won't be undone by the stock ECU's own trims again?

    The 900's pipes would be an interesting proposition indeed, especially for dyno tuning, they're otherwise identical (except the non-ABS Dorso 750 front pipe has one less bend and is slightly shorter).
    2009 Shiver (White) | UK

  4. #49
    apriliaforum expert rule62's Avatar
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    The RB unit overrides the stock ECU trim entirely. Dyno exhaust analysis simply allows the user to dial in the RB more exactly. Variances in the tolerances of the stock narrow-band sensor can be factored into the equation that way, to make sure target AFR is actual AFR. Then fractional adjustments to the RB trim can be set for best power/economy/running conditions, as preferred by the user.

    Could also just have separate O2 bungs welded into the stock headers. RB wide band kits are a couple hundred bucks a piece, though. If I initially planned to go that route, I'd have started with the RB Race unit instead of the EVO. Race includes ignition mapping and quite a few more features, but also at a premium price. For a full-on racer, sure. But for this putt-around bike, the EVO, in its standard form is enough for me. Also why I opted for the "exclusive" model. Which means it cannot be transferred to another manufacturer/bike model, but saved me $75 compared to the non-exclusive EVO, which can be reprogrammed for any make/model. I don't plan to take the module off and install it on any other bike anyway, so it was a $75 savings for a non-issue in my book. If I do get another pony for the track, and I like the EVO a lot... I may start with the RACE to begin with.
    Last edited by rule62; 12-31-2017 at 01:57 PM.
    2014 DD 750 ABS - Spark exhaust, Arrow decat, headers (all ceramic coated), BMC filter, BikeMaster DLFP16-BS LiFePO battery, NGK iridium plugs, GPR steering damper, DD 1200 fully adjustable rear shock w/spring swap, 2016 Tuono Factory wheels, 15/44 520 conversion (PBR/Superlite/DID), Strada-7 fork preload adjusters, Samco 2-piece hose kit w/clamps, Engine Ice, Renazco Racing seat, EvoTech tidy tail, Aprilia grab handles, shorty levers, crank-case breather mod, evap-can delete... and a Rapid Bike EVO.

  5. #50
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    That makes sense to me now, you're entirely replacing the signals to the injectors with ones generated from the RB, using its own map, rather than using the stock ECU's own signals as inputs and altering them. I get the motivation for slinging it on the dyno quickly to dial in the AFR according to the specific sensor on your bike.

    Yeah, it's easy enough to add bungs, too, but ether way they're like little ugly warts once you've finished tuning, unless you buy a second set of pipes. You could also sell on the pipes and sensors to someone else so they can do theirs, assuming you can revert to the single narrow band sensor once it's all settled.

    Could you in theory do a map for each cylinder with the unit you have, e.g. by connecting it to the stock sensor moved to each pipe in turn?
    2009 Shiver (White) | UK

  6. #51
    apriliaforum expert rule62's Avatar
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    The wide band sensors would stay in the headers and allow the RB to make real time adaptive maps through CAN-BUS for each cylinder. So... the bungs would be useful warts. Not plugged after the dyno session, but used during bike operation, to continue to refine and adapt the fueling.
    2014 DD 750 ABS - Spark exhaust, Arrow decat, headers (all ceramic coated), BMC filter, BikeMaster DLFP16-BS LiFePO battery, NGK iridium plugs, GPR steering damper, DD 1200 fully adjustable rear shock w/spring swap, 2016 Tuono Factory wheels, 15/44 520 conversion (PBR/Superlite/DID), Strada-7 fork preload adjusters, Samco 2-piece hose kit w/clamps, Engine Ice, Renazco Racing seat, EvoTech tidy tail, Aprilia grab handles, shorty levers, crank-case breather mod, evap-can delete... and a Rapid Bike EVO.

  7. #52
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    Does the unit still use the temperature and MAP sensors?

    I've found out the EVO does not do separate maps per cylinder, so that would indeed be an expensive option for our bikes.
    2009 Shiver (White) | UK

  8. #53
    apriliaforum expert rule62's Avatar
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    Same temp and MAP. The EVO will do separate maps for each cylinder, but not out of the box. The user needs to purchase 2 wide-band add-on modules and then go into advanced RB settings to instruct which injector to map for each O2. Otherwise, the RB unit, out of the box, can store 2 maps which can be selected via software, or by an add-on remote switch. This can be useful when riding to the track. One map for road use, another for when the user gets to the track and maybe wants to lean things out for higher peak power.

    All in all, it's a pretty cool unit. The add-ons make it really cool. There's also quick-shift, Bluetooth, and dash readout modules. The RB EVO will manage all of them.

    As for me... I'm just trying to make sure the lump doesn't run so dang lean in the rev-range I use it in most. Hopefully it'll also reduce the operating temps a bit. Summertime traffic in Arizona can have this bike in the red-light warning zone pretty quickly.

    FatDuc helped a bit, but the RB EVO is an entirely different ballgame.
    Last edited by rule62; 12-31-2017 at 06:26 PM.
    2014 DD 750 ABS - Spark exhaust, Arrow decat, headers (all ceramic coated), BMC filter, BikeMaster DLFP16-BS LiFePO battery, NGK iridium plugs, GPR steering damper, DD 1200 fully adjustable rear shock w/spring swap, 2016 Tuono Factory wheels, 15/44 520 conversion (PBR/Superlite/DID), Strada-7 fork preload adjusters, Samco 2-piece hose kit w/clamps, Engine Ice, Renazco Racing seat, EvoTech tidy tail, Aprilia grab handles, shorty levers, crank-case breather mod, evap-can delete... and a Rapid Bike EVO.

  9. #54
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    It certainly has a lot of features, definitely worth weighing up.
    2009 Shiver (White) | UK

  10. #55
    apriliaforum expert rule62's Avatar
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    I finally got to stretch the bike's legs today. I'm absolutely satisfied with the RB EVO! The base map seems to be pretty good, but it is suited for a stock bike. Mine has a few mods done to it which will affect airflow and fueling; mainly the decat, exhaust, and filter. That's where the RB's adaptive feature really shines. It appears to be adding gobs of fuel in the low/mid rpm, 20-60% throttle cells. The effect is a nice fat torque delivery, right where I want it. Rolling on the throttle in 6th gear is a lot more fun now. Hardly have to downshift to pass anymore. Cracking it down to 5th or 4th though, is a hell of a lot more fun than it used to be. High rpm and throttle position cells are actually taking a bit of fuel out of the equation. The result is that the bike pulls wonderfully, all the way up to the limiter.

    Also, S mode finally has its place in my riding routine. Previously, it felt way to snatchy for my liking. Trying to hold that sweet spot at 4500 rpm, at about 50 mph, in 6th gear always seemed too easily interrupted by bumps in the road which caused my wrist to move ever so slightly, and had the bike lurching or bucking. I wasn't a fan. Now, S mode is actually very rideable. There's still that instant fun factor of S mode's quick actuation of the TB butterflies, which rockets the bike forward, but no more hunting, lurching, bucking when just trying to cruise along at a steady speed. I think this is due to all of the extra fuel at mid rpm. Yay. Fun.

    Also, low speed stuff is much more enjoyable. I spent some time on a bit of dirt/washboard type road today, and also some time following some slow traffic around some mountain grades. Putting along wasn't as much as a chore as it was previously. The bike seemed happy to comply in 3rd gear at lower rpms, where previously I'd be searching between 2nd and 3rd to find a sweet spot.

    So, I'm happy with the RB EVO. Just a few technical questions about the software that I'll be asking the distributor. Mainly regarding over-writing the adaptive map to the base map on my "exclusive" model. I'm not sure if the "exclusive" model (which is $75 cheaper than the "standard" EVO) allows the base map to be over-written. Nevertheless, the stock base map, with the adaptive feature enabled, is doing the trick just fine.
    Last edited by rule62; 01-08-2018 at 08:05 PM.
    2014 DD 750 ABS - Spark exhaust, Arrow decat, headers (all ceramic coated), BMC filter, BikeMaster DLFP16-BS LiFePO battery, NGK iridium plugs, GPR steering damper, DD 1200 fully adjustable rear shock w/spring swap, 2016 Tuono Factory wheels, 15/44 520 conversion (PBR/Superlite/DID), Strada-7 fork preload adjusters, Samco 2-piece hose kit w/clamps, Engine Ice, Renazco Racing seat, EvoTech tidy tail, Aprilia grab handles, shorty levers, crank-case breather mod, evap-can delete... and a Rapid Bike EVO.

  11. #56
    apriliaforum expert rule62's Avatar
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    Got a response about applying the adaptive map settings to the base map. Seems like I missed a "right-click" on the appropriate screen in the software. I'll be giving it a try soon.

    Edit: It worked like a charm. The first set of adaptive values have been overlaid to the base map. Interestingly, there are points at 2000 to 3500 rpm, at partial throttle, where my bike wants as much as +11 points more fuel than the stock Aprilia ECU is programmed to deliver. Also, as much as -7 points less fuel at WOT, high rpm. Most likely explains why the throttle seems smoother in traffic, and how it seems to pull much better to the redline.

    Now, the adaptive feature begins at zero again, and makes additional adjustments. The idea of which is, the adjustments will become less and less as the map optimizes to my particular bike/riding style/atmosphere.
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    Last edited by rule62; 01-08-2018 at 08:04 PM.
    2014 DD 750 ABS - Spark exhaust, Arrow decat, headers (all ceramic coated), BMC filter, BikeMaster DLFP16-BS LiFePO battery, NGK iridium plugs, GPR steering damper, DD 1200 fully adjustable rear shock w/spring swap, 2016 Tuono Factory wheels, 15/44 520 conversion (PBR/Superlite/DID), Strada-7 fork preload adjusters, Samco 2-piece hose kit w/clamps, Engine Ice, Renazco Racing seat, EvoTech tidy tail, Aprilia grab handles, shorty levers, crank-case breather mod, evap-can delete... and a Rapid Bike EVO.

  12. #57
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    Great info, thanks. Once again confirms our beliefs about the stock map. Not sure why they chose to neuter the top end.
    It's especially interesting to me that you still need to pull so much fuel out up there, even with your mods, so I'm even more keen to solve that particular issue on my bike, one way or another.

    Any thoughts / comments yet on fuel efficiency?

    I know that sometimes manufacturers lean out the fuel at cruise speeds / throttle positions. It's also well known that the excessively lean low end on our bikes actually increases fuel consumption, this due to all the stumbling (misfires) requiring larger throttle openings to maintain a given speed. That inconsistent lean running also affects the RBW, and I found that disconnecting the O2 sensor gave the throttle more of a connected feel - it was sharper, but more controllable, and much less lurching or hunting on initial pick-up when cold. It's possible it switches to a different fuel map when it can't rely on the sensor.

    Being able to smoothly chug around is a surprisingly joyful experience, the engine does not complain one bit, all the way down to 2k uphill! Before I didn't dare dip far below 3500.
    2009 Shiver (White) | UK

  13. #58
    apriliaforum expert MARTCO78's Avatar
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    Fascinating stuff.
    I ran the simple O2 optimiser which works very well for city work, making it very smooth and tractable at low RPM with the added benefit if improved mileage. As you say, even though in theory the richening should lead to more fuel used, the reality was that overall less throttle opening was required which netted and overall reduction in consumption.


  14. #59
    apriliaforum expert rule62's Avatar
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    I haven't let the low fuel light come in yet since installing the RB EVO. The dash reading is about the same as it was previously, but I'm not confident that's a real indicator. Plus, I've been pretty gangly on the throttle lately, trying to get the bike to all of the TPS/RPM cells. I'll be sure to take notice of actual gains/losses over the next few fill ups and post the results.

    As for the top end, I think the manufacturer richens the hell out of the stock map for safety. Flooding the cylinders with gas at WOT/high rpm is safer than a potentially lean situation up there.
    Last edited by rule62; 01-09-2018 at 12:31 PM.
    2014 DD 750 ABS - Spark exhaust, Arrow decat, headers (all ceramic coated), BMC filter, BikeMaster DLFP16-BS LiFePO battery, NGK iridium plugs, GPR steering damper, DD 1200 fully adjustable rear shock w/spring swap, 2016 Tuono Factory wheels, 15/44 520 conversion (PBR/Superlite/DID), Strada-7 fork preload adjusters, Samco 2-piece hose kit w/clamps, Engine Ice, Renazco Racing seat, EvoTech tidy tail, Aprilia grab handles, shorty levers, crank-case breather mod, evap-can delete... and a Rapid Bike EVO.

  15. #60
    apriliaforum expert Frodo's Avatar
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    I think the fuelling map is all about meeting emissions regulations at mid/low rpm where testing occurs. Leaner is cleaner intrrms of hydrocarbons.
    My custom Powercommander map for Pegaso was broadly similar. Pity there is no PC for our bikes.
    Frodo
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