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Thread: Habana / Mojito 50 repair + tuning

  1. #31
    apriliaforum Member
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    well the stock Keihin PWS 12mm has: 90 bend single throttle cable, Fuel in, fuel overflow out

    the oil in and vacuum are on the engine....im guessing i just leave these alone
    2004 Aprilia Mojito Retro 50cc
    2003 Vespa ET2 50cc
    2001 Triumph TT600
    1993 Yamaha Razz 50cc

  2. #32
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    yes your all set.
    Last edited by sublunacy; 04-23-2017 at 11:37 AM.
    --- diploma for engine repair in 2012 ---

    derbi bullet 2006 - piaggio AC - malossi T.C. half - custom GPS dash - TPR 70CC - topperf crank - vl13 reed and spacer- yamaha rt180 kickstand - giannelli shotV4 - phbg 21mm - doppler mesh top venturi filter

    complete wtp volta bmx 2012 - sanko seamless japanese cromoly heat treated and blue printed frame - 21lbs

    1992 lt250r suzuki quadracer - maier plastics -chromed shearer pipe - chromed works suspension - ++++++++ - 220lbs

    previous vehicles - subaru legacy turbo 1991 - mazda mx6 turbo 1990.

  3. #33
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    ok great...do you think its unwise to break in the replacement bbk with my stock carb with that larger main?....or should i wait and get that 14mm carb?
    2004 Aprilia Mojito Retro 50cc
    2003 Vespa ET2 50cc
    2001 Triumph TT600
    1993 Yamaha Razz 50cc

  4. #34
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    the pipes are to vigorous for the fuel supply. 12mm carb stops atomizing like the factory intended when the hp is greater than the cfm will allow. why ? because dell/mik/keih know what they are doing.
    --- diploma for engine repair in 2012 ---

    derbi bullet 2006 - piaggio AC - malossi T.C. half - custom GPS dash - TPR 70CC - topperf crank - vl13 reed and spacer- yamaha rt180 kickstand - giannelli shotV4 - phbg 21mm - doppler mesh top venturi filter

    complete wtp volta bmx 2012 - sanko seamless japanese cromoly heat treated and blue printed frame - 21lbs

    1992 lt250r suzuki quadracer - maier plastics -chromed shearer pipe - chromed works suspension - ++++++++ - 220lbs

    previous vehicles - subaru legacy turbo 1991 - mazda mx6 turbo 1990.

  5. #35
    apriliaforum prov-nov raffaello's Avatar
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    God, jixaw, you are right There are only 3 inlets/outlets on the stock carb: fuel in, vacuum and the fuel 'overflow'? And the oil gets from the pump directly to the block, just by the reed valve, on both sides, as on this photo.

    But that means that the cylinder will get a bigger amount of air/fuel mixture (we also know that the surface that needs to be oiled is bigger) but as the oil is pumped directly into the engine, it will get the same amount of oil! Hmm...

    All of the intake manifolds for minarelli I saw on the internet are not as high as the ones for the morini engine. And I'm afraid that there will be not enough space to fit in the reed valve, carb, air filter set. Unless we decide to put a different filter.

    Minarelli, minarelli, minarelli, morini, morini installed on the engine.

    I just found a pollini intake manifold for the minarelli engine that possibly could fit! It's two pieces, a metal ring and a rubber manifold that can be turned around to get a perfect angle. Though they say that it's designed for 19/21 mm dellorto's, so its diameter could be too wide for the 14/16 mm carbs...

    One more thing, guys... I asked the shop I bought the kit from to mesure the exhaust diameter of the 70 cc kit. Guess... Nope, you're wrong. They mailed me it's 30 mm . Jixaw, as you already put your hands on your kit, can you please confirm that diameter for me?

    Installing the wrist pin bearing is simple. To change the cylinder you will have to take down the head and the cylinder. You'll still have the piston on the crankshaft. You have to take out the two spring wire protection rings which are on both sides of the bolt in the piston, then push the bolt with the bearing out of the piston. Clean the crankshaft, put some grease on the new bolt and the new bearing, put the bearing into the crankshaft, slide gently the bolt through one side of the piston, then the bearing in the crankshaft and the other side wall of the piston. And then secure the bolt with the new spring wire protection rings on both sides of the piston.
    Bella 2wheels - 2001 Aprilia Habana / Mojito 50
    Bella 4wheels - 2001 Alfa Romeo 156 Sportwagon 2.0 TS

    Italians know how to make it beautiful

  6. #36
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    I dont remember there being a vacuum on the carb but if there is its easy enough to connect....

    not sure how that increased air/fuel to stock oil ratio will be affected...maybe sublunacy can chime in....

    let me know how you make out with those intake manifolds...i had some struggles last year when i tried to get a good fit....the angles werent the same and i had trouble fitting the carb....the float bowl on this stock carb is small and shallow...the new carb might hang lower and interfere with the transmission case.....

    I will measure the diameter of the exhaust port when i am home from work today......

    Thanks for explanation of wrist pin bearing replacement....i have done a few top end rebuilds before but havent done that bearing...i wasnt sure if it was pressed in
    2004 Aprilia Mojito Retro 50cc
    2003 Vespa ET2 50cc
    2001 Triumph TT600
    1993 Yamaha Razz 50cc

  7. #37
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    raffeallo the exhaust port width is 30mm and the outlet is 19mm round hole on the cylinder you are looking at. you might want to look up the cfm/hp ratio of 30mm. it would be about 30hp so im sure that is not right.

    --
    you can increase the oil flow rate. by clocking the lever further/ or maybe a screw adjustment/ or by adding a few ounces of oil at fill ups.
    --

    i looked at the pictures and i think you need to weld up a carb adaptor to fit a dellorto 16mm onto the stock manifold. easy enough.
    however a manifold upgrade and a dellorto phva 17.5mm ED carb that has the low profile float bowl should do it too.
    Last edited by sublunacy; 04-23-2017 at 06:29 PM.
    --- diploma for engine repair in 2012 ---

    derbi bullet 2006 - piaggio AC - malossi T.C. half - custom GPS dash - TPR 70CC - topperf crank - vl13 reed and spacer- yamaha rt180 kickstand - giannelli shotV4 - phbg 21mm - doppler mesh top venturi filter

    complete wtp volta bmx 2012 - sanko seamless japanese cromoly heat treated and blue printed frame - 21lbs

    1992 lt250r suzuki quadracer - maier plastics -chromed shearer pipe - chromed works suspension - ++++++++ - 220lbs

    previous vehicles - subaru legacy turbo 1991 - mazda mx6 turbo 1990.

  8. #38
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    yes here - treatland.com dellorto sha carb adaptor. its $5.99 and aluminum to fit a 24mm phva/phbg aftermarket manifold.
    --- diploma for engine repair in 2012 ---

    derbi bullet 2006 - piaggio AC - malossi T.C. half - custom GPS dash - TPR 70CC - topperf crank - vl13 reed and spacer- yamaha rt180 kickstand - giannelli shotV4 - phbg 21mm - doppler mesh top venturi filter

    complete wtp volta bmx 2012 - sanko seamless japanese cromoly heat treated and blue printed frame - 21lbs

    1992 lt250r suzuki quadracer - maier plastics -chromed shearer pipe - chromed works suspension - ++++++++ - 220lbs

    previous vehicles - subaru legacy turbo 1991 - mazda mx6 turbo 1990.

  9. #39
    apriliaforum prov-nov raffaello's Avatar
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    Hello Guys,

    I looked at the SHA carbs. No e-choke on them, unless there are different models not available in Poland. And I do not see a possibility to use manual choke or no choke at all on the Habana. The SHA carbs prices are not much lower here than those of the PHVA carbs, so I will probably stay with my first choice.

    As for the intake manifold, I found 2 different ones produced by 101 octane that combined together would fit. Both are two parts: an aluminium ring to put on the carter and a rubber tube to connect to the carb.The minarelli one with a shorter rubber, and the piaggio one with a longer rubber, that seems also to have a right angle But I'm still a little bit afraid that it's height won't be sufficient to avoid the carb touching the engine. It depends of the carb we will choose. Looking at the german / english site of the same company, I found a few malossi and polini intakes at 45 EUR already on a aluminium ring for minarelli: here.

    The idea is to finally choose the carb, buy it and then choose the proper intake, depending on the diameter and height.

    I've watched a couple of French tutorials this weekend on youtube, they say that the carb should be installed on a rubber manifold to lower the vibrations, in order to eliminate the possibility to transform a homogeneous air/fuel flammable mixture into an incombustible emulsion... I was ment to study chemistry a long time ago, so do I understand the difference, but have no idea if it is possible elsewhere than the chemist's laboratory. Looking at the above linked shop I could see at least two solid aluminium intakes from polini, so it could be totally rubbish.

    Nevertheless, as for the moment I'll try to stick with the solution described above, especially that I've found a second-hand intake from which I could take the aluminium ring for a good price.

    As we'll have a long weekend next weekend here in Poland, I have to order the parts tomorrow, to get them before the weekend, so I could work a little bit on the Habana during the few days off to come

    I cannot wait to put my hands on the cylinder kit tomorrow
    Bella 2wheels - 2001 Aprilia Habana / Mojito 50
    Bella 4wheels - 2001 Alfa Romeo 156 Sportwagon 2.0 TS

    Italians know how to make it beautiful

  10. #40
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    there are clamp on sha/phbg/phva carbs. you can build/buy/mod your own adaptor that bolts on the stock manifold. find something that looks like it could bolt to the manifold then clamp/jbweld a carb on it.

    --
    i had to do that on my 3hp boat motor. i had a clamp on carb jbwelded to a smaller aluminum manifold. works great.

    ----
    not a single manifold picture you linked to fits like stock. be carefull. if its to low the carb will hit the case. if the carb is off angle more than 10-15 degrees it is not good.
    --- diploma for engine repair in 2012 ---

    derbi bullet 2006 - piaggio AC - malossi T.C. half - custom GPS dash - TPR 70CC - topperf crank - vl13 reed and spacer- yamaha rt180 kickstand - giannelli shotV4 - phbg 21mm - doppler mesh top venturi filter

    complete wtp volta bmx 2012 - sanko seamless japanese cromoly heat treated and blue printed frame - 21lbs

    1992 lt250r suzuki quadracer - maier plastics -chromed shearer pipe - chromed works suspension - ++++++++ - 220lbs

    previous vehicles - subaru legacy turbo 1991 - mazda mx6 turbo 1990.

  11. #41
    apriliaforum prov-nov raffaello's Avatar
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    sublunacy, the problem is not the mounting, but the diameter and the positionning (height / angle, as both of us posted before) of the carb on the manifold.

    I got my cylinder kit It's beautiful
    Bella 2wheels - 2001 Aprilia Habana / Mojito 50
    Bella 4wheels - 2001 Alfa Romeo 156 Sportwagon 2.0 TS

    Italians know how to make it beautiful

  12. #42
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    thats what i was just saying so you dont get the wrong manifold by accident.
    are any of those manifolds for a phva/phbg carb? is the angle level and height ok ? ?

    ~ jixaw would hate to get the wrong manifold~
    Last edited by sublunacy; 04-25-2017 at 11:35 AM.
    --- diploma for engine repair in 2012 ---

    derbi bullet 2006 - piaggio AC - malossi T.C. half - custom GPS dash - TPR 70CC - topperf crank - vl13 reed and spacer- yamaha rt180 kickstand - giannelli shotV4 - phbg 21mm - doppler mesh top venturi filter

    complete wtp volta bmx 2012 - sanko seamless japanese cromoly heat treated and blue printed frame - 21lbs

    1992 lt250r suzuki quadracer - maier plastics -chromed shearer pipe - chromed works suspension - ++++++++ - 220lbs

    previous vehicles - subaru legacy turbo 1991 - mazda mx6 turbo 1990.

  13. #43
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    hey guys update..... so i did not have a failure of the cylinder.......my problem was that the variator nut spun off the crank and was rattling around in the transmission case....I guess i didnt use the proper threadlock...i have since fixed that and am back on the road

    I'm ready to help identify a good manifold solution.....sublunacy is right...if the angle isnt right, the float bowl will make contact with the engine...it has to be the right height and angle.... in fact im thinking something like this might be the best bet https://www.scooterswapshop.com/coll...e-carb-adapter ...as long as the increase in length doesnt push the carb too far back.....id love to be able to use my stock airbox - without it the engine is loud
    2004 Aprilia Mojito Retro 50cc
    2003 Vespa ET2 50cc
    2001 Triumph TT600
    1993 Yamaha Razz 50cc

  14. #44
    apriliaforum prov-nov raffaello's Avatar
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    I'm happy to read that it was only a nut

    For the linked adapter, what do you want to attach it to? Stock intake manifold? It makes no sense I think, as it will act as a bottleneck for the mixture. I'm also keeping the stock airbox, with the exception of a bigger intake snorkel (unless at this moment), so we should be looking at a set (carb, intake manifold) which total length should be similar to the original one...

    What carb are you finally getting?

    The piaggio intake manifold from 101 octane I'd linked to a couple of posts before seems to have the right angle, but no idea about it's height. On the photo it looks a little bit too short (in height). But SHA carbs are smaller than PHVA, so it could possibly fit. And on the other side it could be interesting and give us the possibility to put a spacer underneath the reed valve on the carter, to let the air flow gently through the carter to the cylinder.

    As for the carb - I had another observation - there are left / right models... Which can lead to a couple of aditionnal small issues - cables and hoses length to ajust and ease of access to the carb regulation bolts. The idea is to have access from the left of the Habana / Mojito.

    I've ordered mine PHVA today. The 14 mm ones I've found in Poland were not the correct side, there was not even a single PHVA in 16 mm available So I'm getting the 17,5 mm one The price of the correct model was around 30% higher than those ones that won't fit...

    I also got the polishing stuff to take care of the carter and the cylinder / piston.

    The remaining parts to get are:

    airbox snorkel
    intake manifold
    reed valve spacer
    carb jets
    cylinder mounting bolts and nuts
    exhaust mounting bolts and nuts
    engine front silent blocks
    front braking pads
    central stand spring
    a few missing bolts

    I could also work on the stand - it has been welded, is a little bit rusted, and needs some attention. And as I won't need it for a couple of days... I think I'll give it a go
    Last edited by raffaello; 04-25-2017 at 12:41 PM.
    Bella 2wheels - 2001 Aprilia Habana / Mojito 50
    Bella 4wheels - 2001 Alfa Romeo 156 Sportwagon 2.0 TS

    Italians know how to make it beautiful

  15. #45
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    I like that adaptor jixaw posted. It looks small/ 14-16mm and the rubber part is not needed for a clamp on carb like a sha/phbg. @close anyway@

    ---
    a phva with a spiggot fitting would not have been my first choice but hopefully you got the phva ED with a low profile float bowl atleast?

    im sure moving the carb back an inch on a port matched adaptor is better than not doing it and messing with other options.

    raffaello i can keep up to any tuning discussions- dont add a reed spacer but a manifold spacer is ok...

    -----
    i will catch you guys later ok. have fun and keep in touch!
    --- diploma for engine repair in 2012 ---

    derbi bullet 2006 - piaggio AC - malossi T.C. half - custom GPS dash - TPR 70CC - topperf crank - vl13 reed and spacer- yamaha rt180 kickstand - giannelli shotV4 - phbg 21mm - doppler mesh top venturi filter

    complete wtp volta bmx 2012 - sanko seamless japanese cromoly heat treated and blue printed frame - 21lbs

    1992 lt250r suzuki quadracer - maier plastics -chromed shearer pipe - chromed works suspension - ++++++++ - 220lbs

    previous vehicles - subaru legacy turbo 1991 - mazda mx6 turbo 1990.

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