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Thread: AAAAAARRRGGGGHHHH!!!!! Frustrated with Dead Peg!

  1. #1
    apriliaforum Junkie SJL's Avatar
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    AAAAAARRRGGGGHHHH!!!!! Frustrated with Dead Peg!

    Morning All!


    I have a 1993 UK spec Pegaso 650 with the Rotax engine.

    I have come to use it, and started it up, driven it out of my back garden, round the front of the house, turned it off, locked up the back garden and house, got back out of the house and started it up again.

    It started ok, but as soon as I try to put any power on, the engine dies.

    So.... I took the fuel tank off, removed the fuel, took the taps off the tank and made sure that both sides are clear, found that the breather at the bottom was solid so drilled that out with 3mm drill bit, then put it all back together.

    Now it will not even start!!!!!

    I have flattened both my usual YB14LA2 battery and my "test" CB14LA2 battery trying to start it. It has a 10k ohm resistor near to the battery if that makes any difference??


    This bike has been difficult to start ever since I got it; maybe there is an underlying cause?

    Just in case it may shed any light on the issue, since I bought the bike, I have done cylinder head gasket, water pump oil & water seals, cleaned out ignition lock barrel and the attached electrics, replaced plug, replaced battery, replaced both float valves in the carb, replaced a cracked oil filter cover (and rubber seal) and done a number of oil changes, all in the space of 6 months (and about 6 hours riding!)!

    I am running out of patience with this bike....... anyone out there got any ideas where to look for the next problem???

    Can anyone point me in the right direction? Am I missing something blindingly obvious?

    Cheers,

    Ste

  2. #2
    apriliaforum Junkie
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    Hmmmm.... how about the side stand switch?
    Run the fuel to the carbs from aux source, bottle or so, to avoid the fuel tank.
    Hook up to a car battery, it will crank better.
    10 Ohm is good.
    Take a look at the starter relay, connections and so....
    And see about the kill switch........corroded perhaps.
    If all fails,,,,,,,back to the carbs. Seats, needles, ......

    For a almost 20 year old bike........ not bad.

  3. #3
    apriliaforum Junkie SJL's Avatar
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    Morning stisma! Its been a while since we last "spoke"!

    The side stand has not worked since I bought the bike, and the wires have been broken prior to me getting it. It is on an ever growing list of things to do!

    The frustrating thing is it worked; then the only job I did was clear out the breather and check the main and reserve fuel tap and it stopped working again!

    This bike has always (since I got it) cranked for at least a minute or so (if not longer) before firing up, and sometimes the starter is really slow before it actually fires; does this indicate sprag clutch issues??

    So...... Jobs for this morning....... Check starter relay connections, kill switch, and put battery back on after 8 hours cooking!

    Many Thanks in advance!

    Cheers,

    Ste

  4. #4
    apriliaforum Junkie SJL's Avatar
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    Oh and while I am having a rant and thinking about it..... My neutral light stays on constantly. Does anyone have a picture of the location of the neutral sensor and details on testing it??

    Cheers,

    Ste

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    Neutral switch is behind the sprocket cover r.hand side. A pig to get off with the brake peddle in the way, ask me how I know!! I assume its a fairly simple switch, so i would assume "short" circuit when in neutral and "open" when in gear. But as the light is staying on then its fairly safe to assume the switch is permanently stuck in "short".
    I really feel for you on the other problem, my peg spent over a year in the shed not running. And to cap it all, I still do not know to this day why it started working again. The bit about cutting out when you apply throttle would seem to point to carbs. But your gonna have to go through all the usual suspects. Fuel/Air/spark. As Stisma said, use an external fuel supply. Undo float bowl drain screws to check if fuel is getting that far. Also try a little petrol direct into the bores or engine inlet with carbs off. Air filter blockages? Good healthy fat spark? Let us know what you find.

  6. #6
    apriliaforum Junkie SJL's Avatar
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    Cheers Robg!

    Have had a few jobs to do so haven't got around to taking the tank off, probably will be done in the morning, then carbs off for a good clean out again in case any muck has got in.

    What part of the UK are you based?

    Cheers,

    Ste

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by SJL View Post
    .....Have had a few jobs to do so haven't got around to taking the tank off......
    Ahhh, you must have met my wife then. That is the exact thing she tells me, and anyone else who care's to listen, in the week leading up to a bank holiday......


    I am down in Northamptonshire. I kind of envy you chaps up North. Your luck enough to have some fantastic roads and scenery right on your doorstep. Good luck with the bike.

  8. #8
    apriliaforum Junkie SJL's Avatar
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    Well here goes.....
    Eventually, I have managed to get my spanners out.....

    So to summarise....

    Engine starting, running ok, but dies as soon as power is put on.
    Stripped off carbs, stripped carbs down and replaced idle mix O rings, floats, basically a carb rebuild, then bike back together.

    Now not starting! Grrrrrr!

    Head scratching starts...... Back to basics..... Does it have a good spark? - Ahhhhh; well it helps if the plug is fully screwed in !!!!!! Doh! I can hear the laughter already!

    The thing that threw me was the fact that it would start; the compression must have been pushing the spark plug out which was killing the compression!

    Now, plug screwed in fully, have taken it out for a 20 mile run, no issues.

    Well we live and learn!

    What a muppet!

    Now who is going to add the first laugh????

    Cheers, (Happy now!)
    Ste
    I am not an expert, please make your own judgement on diagnosis prior to doing anything drastic! I cannot accept any responsibilty for any work done on suggestions from me! If you are unsure, please contact your local garage.

  9. #9
    apriliaforum Junkie SJL's Avatar
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    And the funnier thing is - I started my career as a mechanic!!!!!! (But have not done mechanics for 10 years)

    My excuse is I was tired.......

    But the reason I have told you all is so someone else doesn't make the same STUPID mistake!
    I am not an expert, please make your own judgement on diagnosis prior to doing anything drastic! I cannot accept any responsibilty for any work done on suggestions from me! If you are unsure, please contact your local garage.

  10. #10
    apriliaforum Junkie
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    Those things happen to everyone, it's just that very few ever admit it.
    But good to hear that all is good again.

  11. #11
    apriliaforum Junkie SJL's Avatar
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    Ok, it starts.... but only after a few minutes of cranking it over.

    Whan warm, it starts almost straight away.

    Any Ideas?

    Is it worth putting on the replacement reg/rectifier that I got last week off a Suzuki 600 Bandit?

    Cheers,

    Ste
    I am not an expert, please make your own judgement on diagnosis prior to doing anything drastic! I cannot accept any responsibilty for any work done on suggestions from me! If you are unsure, please contact your local garage.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by SJL View Post
    Now who is going to add the first laugh????
    Not me mate! I've now added a few hundred miles to mine after it decided to not start/idle/run, and/or any combination of those, for a good few MONTHS after a head gasket replacement, and a couple of sets of carbs later. And then as if by magic decided one day to work perfectly.

    There's certainly one long(ish) thread on the cold/warm start, so have a look back in the forum. Cant be bothered to look tonight as there is a can of stella in front of me and girls doing rude things on another web page........

  13. #13
    apriliaforum Junkie SJL's Avatar
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    Cheers Fellas,
    Can't do anything at the moment because there is 350 miles between me and bike...... Oh well, gotta pay for it somehow!
    I am not an expert, please make your own judgement on diagnosis prior to doing anything drastic! I cannot accept any responsibilty for any work done on suggestions from me! If you are unsure, please contact your local garage.

  14. #14
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    I certainly spend way to much time reading these posts....
    Stumbled on this....

    Quote Originally Posted by SJL View Post
    ... then the only job I did was clear out the breather and check the main and reserve fuel tap and it stopped working again!
    Is it possible that a amount of gunk, junk or something clogged the fuel line/filter to the carbs?
    See the small plastic fuel filter in the T-fitting where fuel feeds both carbs.
    And I suppose UK bikes do not have vacuum valve infront of the carb.

    Just me.......reading, killing time.

  15. #15
    apriliaforum Junkie SJL's Avatar
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    Ahhhh.... It seems I have have had two posts on the go at once! I do get sidetracked sometimes when my brain goes off on a wander!!!!

    I don't think mine has the vacuum valve, and have made sure the filter is clear.

    It is sorted now, the engine usually runs better with the spark plug fully screwed in - mine must have been screwed in just enough to keep compression, but then compression got too great when I revved it and pushed the plug out with the result that it lost compression - you get the idea????

    Made me feel like a right muppet for a while, but glad it wasn't major Rotax surgery!

    Cheers,

    Ste
    Last edited by SJL; 05-18-2012 at 12:03 AM.
    I am not an expert, please make your own judgement on diagnosis prior to doing anything drastic! I cannot accept any responsibilty for any work done on suggestions from me! If you are unsure, please contact your local garage.

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