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Thread: Project: Vespa 300 SUPER (should end up living up that name)

  1. #1
    Honest always, feared often Micah / AF1 Racing's Avatar
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    Project: Vespa 300 SUPER (should end up living up that name)

    Well here it is, my recently delivered (without keys) 2010 Vespa 300 Super in gloss black, it was a dealer re-crated bike and returned to PGA "as new". Since it came with no keys I currently have no way of knowing the exact mileage but the ECU, lockset, and good keyset I have are now off to the hacker's for code extraction, re-key-ing and cloning, I simply was not prepared to pay the asking price for a complete new ecu/lock set. My actual cost even as a dealer was still a rather offensive number.

    She is a beauty, even if in that "diamond in the rough" sort of way. Obviously some body and paint work will be required as the project enters it's final phases but long before I worry about that I am certain some cutting and welding on the stock sheet metal will occur anyway. I asked for a damaged one, for cheap, and PGA delivered. I doubt it has more than 100 miles on it. I have been wanting to play seriously with an EFI 250-300 Vespa for a long time as most of you know but they only come and go as far as demo units and customer bikes so it is hard for me to learn things like "how long does it take for closed loop to learn a new config...etc...".

    Gloss Black, like my heart and my Benz!



    So this will be a different sort of project to make it have value to more Vespa/MP3/SC250-300 owners. I am not going straight to a big valve head, cam, and turbo, this will be done in bite sized little chunks.

    Step 1: Make run as is, allow 600 miles for ecu to learn STFT and LTFT trims and then onto the dyno dead stock.
    Step 2: My "Micah" airbox mod (with detailed pics) to see what exactly that gain, I have done the mod many times and know it works but have never been able to test that mod alone
    Step 3: Pipe testing, I own both the Leo and Akro pipes
    Step 4: Malossi head kit, probably not going to do the cam since the cam spec was not a huge difference between what I measured from a stock cam to the Malossi cam and posted in a previous thread.
    I may have a change of heart about cam and piston I choose to use, the stock setup is perfect for boost, dished piston at .8mm squish
    Step 5: Optional, possibly a Malossi cam and piston test
    Step 6: Tuning, make this naturally aspirated version of the motor run as well as possible, this is a MUST since serious tuning will be required once we move onto "the final solution". I have both a way to manipulate the closed and open loop portion of the load range.
    Step 7: Boost, either turbocharged or supercharged with an AMR 300/500 blower (it is called a Super after all). I love turbos because they use wasted energy to make more power and work perfect on a CVT equipped scooter, since you are always at 6k rpm or better there will be little lag really. Blowers however are friggin' awesome too, nothing beats 10-15 psi of boost from idle to redline....decisions that need not be made too rash! Once boosted in either manner a water/methanol system will be required for intercooling, as will some serious fuels testing.


    Please add your thoughts, while this may be my project I want EVERYONE to learn as much as possible during the course of the event. If I have overlooked something of importance to you please comment in this thread and I will try to make it happen, or test it, and if you have advice I am always open to listening, not that I will take it BUT, I will listen and think on it!

    Once power gets a little more serious than stock levels, injector testing and pump testing will be required as well, as well as a return to the older "return style" EFI system since I like my fuel nice and cool and constantly recirculated. I have several injectors to test but need the MP3 400cc injector and an MP3 500cc injector for this portion of the learning experience, if you have a spare sitting around (dirty is fine I have an injector cleaner) you are willing to donate you can find my shipping address all over this website!

    If stock is about 14.5 bhp to the back tire, I am thinking 22 in naturally aspirated form would be a really strong goal and 32-34 under the added stress of boost would be just right to make the most fun Vespa EVER!!!
    Diminished expectations is the key to happiness in life.

    Micah Shoemaker
    AF1 Racing
    699 W. San Antonio
    New Braunfels, TX 78130
    830-626-3966
    micah@af1racing.com

  2. #2
    apriliaforum Junkie V-Power's Avatar
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    I will be happily putting miles on my mostly unadulterated SportCity 300 while you spend valuable time and money sacrificing your new Vespa to the Speed Gods!

    Now hurry up and get on with it!!!

  3. #3
    apriliaforum expert Buckeroo Bob's Avatar
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    I hope you will try to keep the modified airbox as quiet as possible.

  4. #4
    Honest always, feared often Micah / AF1 Racing's Avatar
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    It only makes a ssmall amount more noise with the modified airbox, a pleasant low frequency humm really, no biggie. Maybe some video/audio will be in order along the way. Even the fully built at uranyl aspirated motor will be tested with the stock pipe to how much restriction it really offers and because I like quiet too!



    Here is the dead stock airbox removed and ready for surgery!





    Here is the inside of the airbox after removing the internal baffle to get more flow into the resonance chamber where the intake to the throttle body is attached:




    This is a shot looking from the bottom of the airbox into the intake tube which goes to the air filter side of the airbox...you can easily see my crude yet effective change...the big square hole added with the Dremel!



    This is a pic taken from the inside looking out...even though the intake area has grown by 300% noise did not even go up on the intake side by 3db! Not bad, and good for about a 1bhp increase from the bottom to the top of the rev range even with the stock small valve head on the motor!

    Diminished expectations is the key to happiness in life.

    Micah Shoemaker
    AF1 Racing
    699 W. San Antonio
    New Braunfels, TX 78130
    830-626-3966
    micah@af1racing.com

  5. #5
    apriliaforum Member
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    Micah, I have access to an Aprilia Scarabeo ie 500cc injector? Will that help you? I am in Australia, but following this boosting idea like your number 1 disciple.

  6. #6
    apriliaforum newb
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    I am also very interested in this one. I am in Australia, too far away for a visit so will follow the thread. I am retired but like to fiddle, especially with engines. My two daily rides are a modified Italjet Dragster 180 two stroke scooter and a Benelli Velvet 400 scooter.
    My current project is another Italjet Dragster which I have fitted a GTS 250 engine, almost finished. Like you I am going the forced induction route, I have both an AMR300 blower and an IHI RHB31 turbo. I prefer the supercharger but the Dragster is such a small scooter I cannot see any available space to fit the thing. So turbo it will be to start off with. The current plan is to run the scooter standard for a while, then switch over to a Keihin PWK 36mm carby and run E85 ethanol. Hopefully, once the turbo is fitted, by running E85 we should not have to lower the compression, depending on what boost the turbo produces (I have three engines so we can have one mistake or two). I know the carby seems a backward step but I do not have the knowledge or resources to fine tune the injection on the E85. I have a wide band gauge so that will help a bit with tuning. With the carby we will try draw thru first, as that is probably the easiest setup even if not the best, to see what happens then decide how to proceed from there.
    Anyway, looking forward to see how your project works out, it may change my mind on some things.

  7. #7
    Honest always, feared often Micah / AF1 Racing's Avatar
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    Well it fired to life for the first time yesterday...for me at least. Airbox mod was pre done since I have had a lot of time to kill waiting for a ccheap enough ecu and Lockset to come up my way. many thanks to PGA Technical for the one running it now. Man this scooter is a total abortion, crashed with shit damage repair everywhere. No two fasteners match...working my way along with it though. Hopefully I get a dyno baseline in today. Where to find the best ddeal on Malossi parts now...I need a head and a cylinder/piston kit bad, the stock micro valves are a severe limitation. It is still way faster than my 200cc Vespa up to say 40mph but about dead even with the 200cc from 40 mph all the way to the rev limiter.

    More to come now that it runs...must get Malossi V4 head!



    For those of you who have never seen the Aisin AMR300 blower, 300cc displacement per rotor revolution....about perfect for doing a Vespa with HUGE torque!


    Diminished expectations is the key to happiness in life.

    Micah Shoemaker
    AF1 Racing
    699 W. San Antonio
    New Braunfels, TX 78130
    830-626-3966
    micah@af1racing.com

  8. #8
    Honest always, feared often Micah / AF1 Racing's Avatar
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    We have spark and fuel! This bike was sold to us by Piaggio as "new" and to their credit it arrived in what appeared to be an unopened crate. Upon removal from the crate it seemed obvious it had some mileage...and damage...and missing parts. Piaggio did the right thing and sold it to me for parts value and now after 5 months of ecu hacking and a generous gift from the Tech Dept at PGA it is back to running under it's own power! 15.6 bhp was the baseline on the dyno with nothing modified other than the intake to the airbox! When I get the cash together for the Malossi V4 head things will start to get very interesting very quickly. I am trying to get a severely discounted Akro pipe from our PU Rep to complete the naturally aspirated version of the motor...what happens over the winter...well...you guys know I have a real boost fetish right?

    So in total I have found damage from the front to the back of the bike, evidence it was a flood survivor, have estimated mileage at roughly 1,500 miles based on tire wear...odometer drive gear was removed by whoever the previous dealer was that rode/crashed/shittily repaired the bike...down the rabbit's hole. it is better for me to start out with damaged bikes, since they only tend to get more damaged during the time I own them!
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    Diminished expectations is the key to happiness in life.

    Micah Shoemaker
    AF1 Racing
    699 W. San Antonio
    New Braunfels, TX 78130
    830-626-3966
    micah@af1racing.com

  9. #9
    apriliaforum Member
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    Any details on the air box mod?

  10. #10
    Honest always, feared often Micah / AF1 Racing's Avatar
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    Yeah, I just removed the short baffle between the filtered and clean air side and cut the intake tube open to full width near the point where it enters the airbox. I will take some pics of the next one I do or of this one when it comes off again. Waiting on my speedo drive gear and then it is time to rock this bike on the street.


    Micah


    Diminished expectations is the key to happiness in life.

    Micah Shoemaker
    AF1 Racing
    699 W. San Antonio
    New Braunfels, TX 78130
    830-626-3966
    micah@af1racing.com

  11. #11
    apriliaforum Member
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    A few photos would be good, my is still 100% stock so I am going to follow your build out. I need to keep it very reliable so it does not leave my wife stranded. It would be very interested in seeing if the stock exhaust works out, she hates a loud bike!

  12. #12
    Honest always, feared often Micah / AF1 Racing's Avatar
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    I do not think the stock exhaust is going to be the primary restriction even in a motor with a big valve head. So far the most I have gained from any pipe on one of these engines is only 1.5bhp which is pretty decent but not spectacular.

    Here is the reason the stock cylinder head is unimpressive when it comes to actually making power, theses are a set of pics using all stock parts to compare to the Malossi parts later.



    From the intake side of the head looking into the exhaust ports....where you see carbon built up there is only low speed, usually subsonic exhaust flow. It is hard to imagine that even the micro valve version of the head lacks velocity...but this is all about reading the tea leaves...



    The intake ports at the junction between the intake valve seats and the head casting basically suck if peak power is a goal in your engine build, if all you want your Vespa 200/250/300cc to do is get amazing fuel economy then just leave all the head stuff alone, I doubt making 30% power gains will help fuel economy at all if that extra power is used!



    Here is a bare stock head...you can clearly see how large the bore diameter is compared to the valve area...easy power is easy to spot, even if far from free to extract from the little one lunger!




    The "hot side" looking in...wow, they really did everything they could to neuter this motor before unleashing them upon us public...one would think this port should be dry and friggin clean as lean as these motors run...not the case I guess...easy enough to fix with porting or simply porting a new Malossi V4 head...better yet...the stock head is just not going to cut it. Btw, this head was run at full power on the dyno for close to thirty minutes before tearing down the next day...seems to me it really should be close to spotless inside!



    Here are the stock valves after cleaning compared to a Rotax/Aprilia V990 intake valve behind. The basic design with "wasted" stems on the intake side is pretty good looking, maybe the best looking dead stock part!

    Diminished expectations is the key to happiness in life.

    Micah Shoemaker
    AF1 Racing
    699 W. San Antonio
    New Braunfels, TX 78130
    830-626-3966
    micah@af1racing.com

  13. #13
    apriliaforum Member
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    So your plans are for malossi v4, then boost?

    I eagerly await!

  14. #14
    Honest always, feared often Micah / AF1 Racing's Avatar
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    Yeah, boost is the end game for this motor. Every time I ride it I pretend it is turbocharged...this winter hopefully I can stop pretending. I already have lots of metal tubes, the modified oil cooler from an RSV4 for the intercooler, spare ecu, pumps, injectors and the turbocharger and a lot of laser cut flanges for building the dump pipes and such. What I distinctly lack right now is free time!

    Here is the end game...IHI RH03B, the smallest new turbocharger I could afford that seems sized basically right for this project!





    She is a very pretty little work of mechanical art yes?





    Here is the hot side!






    Finally we get to the cold side, or at least cooler side after intercooling with an anti-det mixture of 50% water and 50% Methanol:


    Diminished expectations is the key to happiness in life.

    Micah Shoemaker
    AF1 Racing
    699 W. San Antonio
    New Braunfels, TX 78130
    830-626-3966
    micah@af1racing.com

  15. #15
    apriliaforum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Micah / AF1 Racing View Post
    Yeah, boost is the end game for this motor. Every time I ride it I pretend it is turbocharged...this winter hopefully I can stop pretending. I already have lots of metal tubes, the modified oil cooler from an RSV4 for the intercooler, spare ecu, pumps, injectors and the turbocharger and a lot of laser cut flanges for building the dump pipes and such. What I distinctly lack right now is free time!
    eagerly awaiting to hear how all this goes!!!

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