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Thread: Tank deforming/bulging anyone?

  1. #16
    apriliaforum Junkie V-4ce's Avatar
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    After seeing my bike under some different lighting last night I noticed that the left side of it looks the same as that last picture.
    In the garage: '10 RSV4-R x2 '94&95 VFR750F '01&'09 SV650S '04 DR650 '85 VF500F '83 DT-80K '07 CBR600RR

  2. #17
    apriliaforum Member Yellaghost's Avatar
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    Try to get confirmation by tactile, I thought it was some reflection but after I felt it with my hand...bumpy indeed!
    p.s. I do hope the Ape folks will no repeat the Ducati's mistake

  3. #18
    apriliaforum Member
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    i have the same problem and don't have evap either . looks like these plastics don't like heat. on my brother bike the lower plastic got deform too. but the tank don't look as bad of those picture YELLAGHOST took.

  4. #19
    apriliaforum prov-nov
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    If you guys are in the USA it's not because of pressure or heat, it's because of the ethanol in the gas there, as stated before.

    Ducati has had numerous warranty issues over this issue and have been replacing tanks for customers, and sometimes more than once per customer. The problem is that they aren't shipping corrected tanks, but the same ones that are doomed to repeat the problem.

    Let's hope that Aprilia has more sense than Ducati...

  5. #20
    apriliaforum expert Beau1K's Avatar
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    EPA: 8 years or 80,000 miles.
    "Tuono doesn't want to gently take your hand and guide you on a trip, it wants to rip it off and run away with it! I always get the feeling that to ride a Tuono you have to be a real man, prepared to fight it every step of the way, where as on the Triumph you can have an off day and not be left feeling inadequate"
    "Tact is for people who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic"

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  6. #21
    apriliaforum Member Yellaghost's Avatar
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    Oh Great! Now sitting and hope that this tank and the ethanol will have mercy...
    This is more problem than the damn gf

  7. #22
    apriliaforum Junkie
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    My bike too has this bulging rippling surface on the left side...what's the official status of having it replaced?
    Steve Nunez ~ NYC
    Artist/Custom Painter
    www.stevenunez.com

  8. #23
    apriliaforum Member Hawkeye's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yellaghost View Post
    Try to get confirmation by tactile, I thought it was some reflection but after I felt it with my hand...bumpy indeed!
    p.s. I do hope the Ape folks will no repeat the Ducati's mistake
    Is it Ducati's (or Aprilia's) mistake, or the US EPA's mistake? Remember, the rest of the world don't face this problem with their tanks.

  9. #24
    apriliaforum Member Yellaghost's Avatar
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    IMHO, U.S.A's models seem to be a headache for us riders and Aprilia. I just hope Aprilia will resolute this as good and swift like the engine replacement deal. Certainly, their engineers ought to look into this or cussing us damn yanks for it

  10. #25
    apriliaforum Junkie
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    Ducati issued new tanks- would be nice if Aprilia did the same.
    Steve Nunez ~ NYC
    Artist/Custom Painter
    www.stevenunez.com

  11. #26
    apriliaforum prov-nov
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sentinel View Post
    If you guys are in the USA it's not because of pressure or heat, it's because of the ethanol in the gas there, as stated before.

    Ducati has had numerous warranty issues over this issue and have been replacing tanks for customers, and sometimes more than once per customer. The problem is that they aren't shipping corrected tanks, but the same ones that are doomed to repeat the problem.

    Let's hope that Aprilia has more sense than Ducati...
    Quote Originally Posted by SteveNunez View Post
    Ducati issued new tanks- would be nice if Aprilia did the same.
    Rinse repeat?

    That's no solution...

  12. #27
    apriliaforum prov-nov
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye View Post
    Is it Ducati's (or Aprilia's) mistake, or the US EPA's mistake? Remember, the rest of the world don't face this problem with their tanks.
    It's both Ducati and Aprilia's mistake if they don't correct the problem on their end, and the customers will continue to be put in danger and screwed...

  13. #28
    apriliaforum Member Yellaghost's Avatar
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    Here's an update on the problem. The tank seems to get a little more bumpy and now spreaded all around the tank horizontally. The bumps are quite defined and one can see whaterver it's inside is causing...I leave that up to the experts in here because I have no idea what's in there




  14. #29
    apriliaforum newb
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    Hello Folks

    I run an email list of Ducati owners who have had tank deformations on their Ducati motorcycles. I am an attorney and have researched the problem extensively and have sent a tank to be examined by a lab.

    IF the Aprilia tanks are the same Acerbis rotomolded tanks as on Ducatis, that is, they are made from Nylon 6 (AKA polyamide 6 or PA6) and the inner surface is not coated, then the problem is due to WATER.

    Do your own research, but Nylon 6 absorbs water, unless treated. Water enters the gas tank due to ethanol's hydrophilic absorption of ambient moisture. This is a well-documented problem with using E10 gasoline -- if your gas sits for any period of time and you have ambient humidity, then water is wicked from the air and clings to the ethanol molecules in your E10 gas.

    By action of gravity, the heavier water then sinks, bringing the ethanol with it. This is called "phase separation." Those of you who work on your bikes probably have seen this when you drain the tank, the first squirts from your gas hose will be watery.

    This leads to water being in direct contact with the inner surface of the tank, and as I mentioned above, water is readily absorbed by untreated Nylon 6.

    It is my belief that when Acerbis made these tanks they were tested using European gasoline, which currently has no ethanol. I believe some locations in Europe have as much as 2% which is used as a fuel line cleaner (ethanol cleans injectors), but this is not enough for the problem to manifest. Also, the problem will probably not show up in drier climates. I have a sample of zip codes from my mailing list and I've confirmed this fact -- very few deformed tanks show up in Arizona and SoCali, but a lot of them are showing up on the east coast and mid-south.

    Ducati has been replacing every tank that comes in regardless of warranty age/expiration. My bike was well out of warranty and they replaced it out of "good will." I know they are testing various solutions, the main one seems to be to coat the inside of the tank with a barrier such as Caswell's. I suggested this to them because several Ducati Multistrada owners tried it and over a year has passed with no problems.

    I can't make any suggestions as I don't know Aprilia's policies. If your bike is under warranty, get it into a shop to make a report. In the USA, you have an emissions warranty mandated by the EPA -- for Ducatis, this is 5 years and 18,000 miles, I don't know what it might be for Aprilias, but it is probably the same (this is separate from your manufacturer's warranty, RTFM)

    Summary:
    1. if tanks are made from PA6,
    2. and you are using E10 gasoline,
    3. then it is probable that the Ethanol is wicking moisture and introducing water,
    4. and PA6 absorbs water.

    If that's not a design defect, I don't know what is. But I'm just an attorney, so what do I know?


    Good luck

    'tiz


    Footnotes:
    On Nylon 6/PA6
    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1...10119/abstract
    http://www.dsm.com/en_US/html/dep/akulonmoisture.htm
    http://www.springerlink.com/content/h046820627255320/
    http://www.zellamid.com/show.aspx?SP=2&url=202PA6

    On Ethanol adsorption of water
    http://www.springerlink.com/content/j2x43q45660x5617/
    http://www.oregon.gov/OSMB/news/E10.shtml
    Last edited by ducatiz; 08-28-2010 at 11:40 AM.

  15. #30
    apriliaforum Member Yellaghost's Avatar
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    Hmmn, the plot thickens indeed. Thanks ducatiz!!

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